Well thanks first up for a friendly and intelligent reply. Usually a lot of people on here get very bitchy, butthurt or even abusive when you criticize their fav movie (and it's a freakin chore to reason with them), but you made some great points defending DH3 which I do agree with to a certain level.
No problem. I've always said that the anonymity of the internet brings out the worst in people. I've dealt with some straight up *beep* on here. At the end of the day though we're just discussing film and no one should have to put up with that crap.
I thought that as well, but always wondered why it wasn't called 'Die Hard 3' which I think sounds better - like it's part of a proper trilogy that includes the full series equally. It was like they avoided calling it 3 so they wouldn't have to count the second one. The movie Predators did the same to Predator 2 - Robert Rodriguez bashing the first sequel and saying the third was a return to the original's style - hence no Predator 3 title.
Yeah it's an interesting thought. I just believe that McTiernan had enough respect for fans of 2 to keep it all open-ended. We don't know why McClane is back in NY as a cop instead of in LA or what happened with Holly. People can make up their own theories. At the end of the day, there is no real hard evidence on whether or not 2 is ignored, just speculation.
I strongly remember either Willis or McTiernan (or both) saying the second movie was basically to be ignored (probably as it was seen as a mere cash in on the original at that time). I can't find any direct quotes from the time but that was the general attitude. It was definitely looked down on, even in 95.
Willis said he had a great time making the sequel. He used to speak very highly of the film. While making the third film he did an interview in which he praised the first two films. It's only recently that he's changed his tune and even went as far as to say that the fourth film was as good as the first. From then on I pay no attention to what he says. As for McTiernan, I'm still trying to find any quotes or interviews from him on DH 2.
It was just a hunch on my part. I remember DH2 got a lot of heat for the scene of crashing a full civilian airliner (which I did agree was a touch much), turning the movie from a summer actioner to a disaster type movie. It seemed like DH3 was addressing that somewhat.
The plane crash scene was also pure fantasy - it's not possible for that to happen in real life (terrorists letting a plane fly blind into the ground using a hijacked control tower). However, terrorist bombs on high streets and across cities is very close to the bone and very realistic and has been seen worldwide. I know which one is less jarring.
Yeah. DHWAV did get a lot of unfair criticism for coming out right on the heel of the OKC bombing. The film's themes just hit too close to home. Though in subsequent years the film has gained a newfound appreciation. And the plane crash in part 2 was certainly ballsy. I did hear it put some people off but I'd say it was necessary to see just how sick these guys were. Also, seeing them blown to hell at the end is much more satisfying for it.
Interesting points and I like that evolution in JM's character dynamic - it's something new. I'm not so sure if he's actually supposed to be a full blown alcoholic, is he? I remember him being hung-over in the first scene and dedicated drinker but not to that extent.
Yeah true I'm not so sure McClane was a step above AA meetings, though with how bad his life had gotten I wouldn't rule it out either. It was interesting seeing McClane in such a jolly mood in the second film though. It really is the only DH film where he is really happy. And why not since his marriage to Holly is in much better standing. It is extremely depressing to know that they will not be together in the next film. Though I'd like to believe that phone call to Holly at the end of 3 ended positively. Screw what DH 4 gave us.
What made DH2 more epic was that scene where he jumps into the annex skywalk from high above, an iconic scene not only in the series but in the entire genre. He flips around, somersaults, pivots, jumps, knocks full force into $hit - and looks totally convincing doing so. In DH3 I didn't get that anywhere near as much, but Willis was 5 years older so it was probably just a victim of time itself. He's still really cool in 3, but in DH2 he was a bonafide action superhero.
Yeah he definitely seemed more agile in the first two films. Though to be fair he was recovering from a bad hangover in the third film. Or it could just be that McTiernan's McClane is a bit less superheroish and more of an everyman than Harlin's McClane. McTiernan's McClane is always down on his luck and more cynical than McClane from part 2. McTiernan's McClane might be a bit more relatable as well since he rarely looks cool doing what he does. He's just a guy trying desperately to survive the situation. McTiernan must have something against marriage as well since he doesn't like to keep John and Holly together haha. Harlin's McClane still has those everyman qualities though that keep the character from becoming a complete action hero caricature unlike Wiseman and Moore who turned their McClanes into a straight up comic book character.
Irons was intentionally hamming things up while never looking ominous. Sadler looked very powerful, evil and intimidating whilst retaining a sense of style and swagger - very classy (and that goes for his henchmen, too). Irons and his cohorts looked like they walked in from an 80s Falco music video.
Sadler was the only villain in the series to truly kick McClane's behind. Simon was a different beast though. He was sophisticated and intelligent much like his brother. They left the dirty work to their henchman. Irons still had his own sense of style and swagger also, much like Hans. They even sounded alike. Brilliant casting imo.
It just gets even better with time. You don't see movies like DH2 anymore. It had three villains, haha. It had a free-for-all on the wing of a moving 747. It's an absolute beast of an actioner. The dialogue, acting and scale is just tremendous. Die Hard 2 was among the last of the old school action movies that came out during the genre's peak in the 80s and early 90s.
Truly the best periods for hardcore action films. The first two Lethal Weapons, Robocop, Predator, The Last Boy Scout and Point Break to name a few more. I own them all. Around the late 90s was when action films became more tame and generic.
Excellent points. You're right. DH3 looks like gold compared to a lot of other similar type movies and rip offs, especially since. It may have used a familiar set up but it was the only one to do it right and do it to the level it did, and for that it is impressive and not generic.
Exactly. The film is just so well constructed, acted and directed. Definitely in my top 5 actioners of the 90s.
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