Troi, who was not adept at things like warp core breaches, somehow passed this test, becoming a full commander, yet Data remained a lieutenant commander after this? Data had total recall of any situation, yet we never saw him tAke the test. Does Starfleet have some protocol in place that says androids can't be promoted as quickly as humanoids? It seems like Data would have grounds to file a grievance up the chain of command.
shareIdk other than the fact that Data knew what he was good at: science.
I see this often with teaching. People with no sense of HOW to handle adults/teachers decide to become administrators. People who say ridikilus, ambalance, liBary, and the T in often are trying to teach children how to speak, write and most importantly, think.
I also have a big problem with people like Ron Clark... the only reason people like him became teachers is to become administrators. and many people who are administrators do it for the 'prestige' and the paycheck. Very few administrators do it because they LIKE learning or children. most can't even edit their memos correctly.
The thing with data is that he was a machine. there was no human factor with him. I remember that part in Booby Trap
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: Have you analyzed the risk factor?
Lt. Commander Geordi La Forge: The numbers say it's even money. It's no better than turning it over to the computer, but no worse either. But I say forget the numbers! There's no way the computer can compensate for the human factor, the, the intuition, the experience.
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: And the wish to stay alive.
so with Data, he unfortunately lacks the intuition, the wish to go home to his wife, put up his feet and have a bacon cheeseburger and a pint of Guinness.
Oh God. Fortune vomits on my eiderdown once more.
Brother's was on today. That's a decent Data episode.
Movie Theater: Young Frankenstein 10/10. RIP Gene Wilder. One of the funniest people of all time.
"..are trying to teach children how to speak, write and most importantly, think."
Me and Bruce Lee know the truth is the opposite of what you are saying here.
"Our parents, the society, authorities always teach us WHAT to think, but not HOW to think." (I am paraphrasing)
Perhaps the Bridge officers test was the final requirement for Troi getting her third pip but I think Data must have already passed it as he was 2nd officer and showing him in command for the night shift once or twice.
I tell you what.
Getting bumped to commander didn't make much sense, perhaps someone with real life experience can explain how ranks and rank increases work for medical corps. for example I could understand Bev being a commander being CMO on a ship with 1000 people of differing species would require a large staff and she'd have more knowledge than a GP but I don't see how Troi would make it above and Lt.
Yes Data was a line officer and third in command of the ship, he didn't need to take a separate bridge officers test it would be part of his training and qualification if it weren't Starfleet would have had someone shuttled out when it was reported Picard was believed killed and Riker abducted during Gambit.
My first guess is that Data is a gigantic security risk just to be posted aboard a Starship, but that's applying common sense to Starfleet, so that's not it.
Troi had a problem with ordering someone to do something that would get them killed. Data might have a similar problem, but I think it also comes down to good prejudice. Yes, sometimes prejudice can be good. Data is a machine, and people rightly would have issues taking orders from a machine, especially an order that leads to their own demise. The definition of a sociopath is someone who cannot empathize with others. Data fits that criteria to a T, because of his lack of emotions and emotional awareness. Incidentally, the show never explicitly proved he was sentient, but they just went along with that notion anyway. We need to know that if we're going to die the person giving that order is putting his own soul on the line here. That he's not going to throw away someone's life because he can. It's bad enough to instill obedience in people as it is, to instill it to an emotionless android is too much to ask anyone, no matter how disciplined they are.
Even an organization as stupid as Starfleet can't let political correctness get too far out of hand.
Data lacked ambition. He had no ego.
People climb the ladder for a lot of different reasons. The most common being to make more money, to be a leader, or to prove something. Data was not interested in any of those things.
There are a lot of people at my work who are highly intelligent, and yet they are not in a leading position, or have a high rank, or whatever, ... And sometimes there are idiots who are in charge.
Data did his job, and he was the best at it.
My 2 cents.
I'm just on my way up to Clavius.
Also people might have a hard time with a machine being in charge of the ship. Especially those who have never served with him before. 💻
Luke Skywalker, your Mom was hawt! Darth Vader
All swell answers. He could malfunction, and then everything would be chaotic.
Movie Theater: Young Frankenstein 10/10. RIP Gene Wilder. One of the funniest people of all time.
Humans also malfunction and spread chaos.
shareI guess. But, Data gets taken over by aliens and be controlled because he's a machine. Argue with Wylde about it.
Movie Theater: Young Frankenstein 10/10. RIP Gene Wilder. One of the funniest people of all time.
So in "Power Play" Data was taken over by aliens because he was a machine and Troi, O'Brien, and Riker were not taken over because they were biological, I suppose?
shareAnd not to mention the fact the entire crew gets taken over by a game that Riker brought with him which turned the Enterprise crew into puppets of some species to fight their war.Data had to be sabotaged to prevent him from interfering with the plan.
shareData's always getting taken over by something.
Movie Theater: Young Frankenstein 10/10. RIP Gene Wilder. One of the funniest people of all time.
He's more of a risk. Talk to Wylde, I said, Mag. He can explain it better than I.
Movie Theater: Young Frankenstein 10/10. RIP Gene Wilder. One of the funniest people of all time.
"There are a lot of people at my work who are highly intelligent, and yet they are not in a leading position, or have a high rank, or whatever, ... And sometimes there are idiots who are in charge."
This describes almost any job or institution of any kind that has ever existed. My only edit would be to replace "sometimes" with "usually".
He was the Second Officer and Operations Officer.
I'm sure he did take the Officers Bridge Test, just was never promoted.
Troi had to take the test because she never really manned an actual station on the Bridge except when absolutely necessary.
...All that aside, I can not blame her entirely for crashing the 'D'. It was going down no matter who was at the helm.
Worf would've saved it. Lol.
Movie Theater: Young Frankenstein 10/10. RIP Gene Wilder. One of the funniest people of all time.
IMHO there are several different ways to enter Starfleet.
The most common way is to enter Starfleet academy normally or enlist normally, with a minimum age of 18 or possibly 17 (Yeoman Tina "Lizard Girl" Lawton may have been only 17).
There may be a special program recruiting young geniuses to Starfleet Academy and that may be the program Wesley was tested for in "Coming of Age". I assume that all four of the tested were too young for admission the regular way, and too smart to fail the normal admissions test, so they should have been applying to a special and limited program that could afford to be very selective. Some characters might have entered Starfleet via that program - Kirk?, Spock?, one or both Chekovs?, Peter Preston (actor 18, age given as 14 in script and novelization)?, etc..
Similarly there may be different career tracks once in Starfleet and having to take a bridge officers test to stand watch might only be required for medical and psychology officers. Line officers might not always have to take the bridge officers test in order to stand watch, and/or might not always be promoted to commander after passing it.
note that Beverly Crusher was said to have been the "Head of Starfleet Medical" for a year.
WESLEY: That's all right. That will give me the time to finish some projects I have to do. It's going to be hard leaving the Enterprise.
PICARD: Mixed feelings for all of us. It's always difficult leaving any ship, just as it was for your mother
[Corridor]
PICARD: When she left to become head of Starfleet Medical. But going from one assignment to another is part of the life which you are choosing.
WESLEY: I know, but this isn't any ship.
PICARD: How true.
...All that aside, I can not blame her entirely for crashing the 'D'. It was going down no matter who was at the helm.
A lot of movies and shows have continuity issues. It happens.
Movie Theater: Young Frankenstein 10/10. RIP Gene Wilder. One of the funniest people of all time.
Well in those cases the movie has got a good and (sort of)logical script that you tend to forgive them or don't notice it at all,but since the script for Generations was poor(to say the least) these continuity issues stand out like a sore thumb.
shareI never noticed them until you yahoos pointed them out.
Movie Theater: Young Frankenstein 10/10. RIP Gene Wilder. One of the funniest people of all time.
Lots of good answers to this. There is always the possibility that everyone once took the bridge officer's test, including Data, Worf, Yar, and LaForge, with Worf being promoted in "Generations", and LaForge being promoted in the third season. It just didn't make sense to me that Troi was a lieutenant commander herself, often on the bridge, even took charge in "Disaster", but was apparently not a considered a bridge officer until later after she passed the test, making herself a full commander. Yet, Beverly was always a full commander from the get-go, yet did not have any interest in the command structure of starships until much later on. Or, Pulaski when she was a full commander, yet stated she was not a bridge officer.
Very confusing when you put it all together. And, to go further, how about all of those hapless ensigns and other lieutenants that have jobs on the bridge? Did they have to take the test, too? Why didn't Picard have Wesley take the test for that matter?
Try not to think too much about it.
Movie Theater: Young Frankenstein 10/10. RIP Gene Wilder. One of the funniest people of all time.
It's Season 7, the writers were running out of ideas and needed something to do for Bev and Troi beyond their normal roles. Bev and Troi are not officers of the line like Picard, Riker and Data, so they would never be in command of the bridge when their whole experience is being in charge of their department and advancing within their medical field of expertise.
Would you trust someone to be in charge of you that is normally a counselor and took only ONE test of their command abilities? Or would you trust someone who worked their way up through the ranks by manning the Con and Ops positions and spending 15 years on the bridge actually working? The writers didn't think it through.
Everyone has to start somewhere.
It's not like the first day on the right out of school Riker or Picard already had 15 years of experience
She deleted 33,000 e-mails AFTER congress' subpoena for them !
Worf would have the bridge over them, even though they outranked him.
Movie Theater: Young Frankenstein 10/10. RIP Gene Wilder. One of the funniest people of all time.
Exactly, which means Troi needs to put in her time WORKING by slumming it at the Conn console like everyone else. You don't just get to be in command of the bridge and the ship by taking ONE test. Hell, even Wesley would have more experience flying the ship and running the bridge than Troi.
shareYou're probably right.
Movie Theater: Young Frankenstein 10/10. RIP Gene Wilder. One of the funniest people of all time.
Beverly did alright as CO in Descent tough.
shareAw, Nexus. You're a Riker hater? 😞
🎤Always remember to keep Ridin The Storm Out, people!🎸🌿
No I don't hate Riker although he has his moments where his actions are questionable(like so many Trek characters)at least Rockerchick but overall I enjoy Riker at least he gives us some moments of fun.So don't worry I am fan of Trek but I will recognize some flaws a character or a story has but it doesn't prevent me from enjoying the show.
shareGoody, I'm glad. 😂 I agree that his reckless womanizing was to blame for that game incident. And the "Generations" thing was really the writers' fault, not his.
🎤Always remember to keep Ridin The Storm Out, people!🎸🌿
I know it was the writers Rockerchick ,and the destruction of Enterprise-D was not the biggest issue I had with Generations(think the Nexus) but it made him look incompetent when he started talking about plasma coils when he should have rotated shield frequencies a tactic that he came up with(or suggested)during the interactions with the Borg in Best Of Both Worlds.The Riker of the series was in many ways superior to how he was portrayed in the TNG movies ,with the exception of First Contact but that could have been because he directed two of the movies of which oddly enough First Contact is one of them.But to be honest a much smaller and outdated Klingon Bird Of Prey should not have been match for a Galaxy class starship to begin with.It is actually kind of surprise they got a script at all since they were so busy at that time with other Trek things(last season of TNG,new seasons of DS9 and writing episodes for the upcoming VOY series).It might have been better if they had waited a bit longer with the release and should have worked out the plot better and taken out the inconsistencies,but on the other hand they were riding the wave of enormous popularity Star Trek had at that moment.
shareThe commander doesn't need to know how to do the stuff, he just needs to command others to do it and get it done.
Does Picard run down to engineering to readjust the warp cool flux capacitor?
No.
He tells Geordi to do it.
She deleted 33,000 e-mails AFTER congress' subpoena for them !
We're talking about the Bridge, not Engineering. The Commander sure as heck needs to know how things work on the Bridge when they are in control. Remember, Picard took the helm and personally flew the ship through danger in "Booby Trap." Would you trust someone who's commanding you who has no experience flying the ship and actually never WORKS on the Bridge like Troi? I wouldn't.
Once again, Troi is not an officer of the line, she's a medical officer and should have no command over the Bridge through ONE test. It's bad Season 7 writing trying to give her and Bev more to do in the show.
Too little too late at that point, Inspector. Troi's a medical officer. Ha! I bet she can't even write prescriptions.
Movie Theater: Young Frankenstein 10/10. RIP Gene Wilder. One of the funniest people of all time.
Would you trust someone to be in charge of you that is normally a counselor and took only ONE test of their command abilities?
I think it's because the producers messed up with the Rankings from the beginning.
Dr. Crusher was a full commander, which I thought it was because of her being a chief medical officer and was a given.
In Season 2 when Pulaski joined, she clearly said she wasn't a "bridge officer" but also held the rank of Commander. Again, I thought that once you're a chief medical officer, you're automatically enlisted with the rank of Commander. Stupid if you ask me.
So, with Troi, they decided to write some corny excuse why Crusher was a full commander so she can command the Enterprise, even mentioning that Crusher didn't need the rank to be a CMO.
But it still doesn't explain Data now does it?
He was ahead of Crusher on the bridge, even though, technically, she outranked him.
Movie Theater: Young Frankenstein 10/10. RIP Gene Wilder. One of the funniest people of all time.
He was already command level when the series began, so the assumption is he had already taken the test.
share