MovieChat Forums > Amadeus (1984) Discussion > Not a historical account.

Not a historical account.


The movie is very entertaining and well done. However, it has little to do with the life of the real Mozart.

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Look in the "Goofs" section. Not everything in the film is done in the order it really happened. But, this is a genre called "historical fiction", which Means it is not to be viewed as a historical account of Mozart's life.

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I don't see a point in historical fiction of this kind. In my vocabulary it's just a bunch of lies. Most people look at it and think that that's what really happened.

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I absolutely agree. I guess the choice of words for Mozart in the script they wrote was appalling too. Granted he had a sense of humor, but putting coarse and vulgar language into the mouth of western culture's arguably greatest musician is something that cannot be accepted. I mean did he always speak like that?

Also as you mentioned, historically, it didn't make any sense. I was especially disappointed because I watched it with high expectations. I wonder what the critics were thinking rating a crass piece of work so high.

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[deleted]

The movie is a symbolism to represent the differences between raw talent and mediocrity.

Haven't you met someone in your life, who for some unknown reason is simply better than yourself at a particular task ? say, sports, math, whatever... even if you have triple the love and devotion than him, it just comes natural for that person to "be good" at it. That is the point of the movie: it's like an ode to admire these people who for whatever reason, have this unbelievable gift.

Some of the facts in the movie are true (or quite close) while some others aren't. You also have to consider that by that time of Schaffer's script, there wasn't much documentation and reliable sources on Mozart's life. For instance, historicians keep pondering whether if Mozart and Beethoven ever met, as there are no accounts they did, but there aren't also that they didn't.

Some true (or close accurate) facts include:

-Mozart was a genius with an extraordinary memory and ability to produce works in no time. Consider that in a lifetime of about 30 years, he wrote a total of 626 pieces. Compare that to say, Beethoven's 120 in 40 years, Beethoven being a genius too.

-Mozart was very keen on billiards and partying. His vocabulary was also quite scatological.

-Mozart was indeed certain that the requiem was his last work and something "mysterious" was behind it.

-Mozart wasn't very good with money. He made a lot but also spent a lot.


Some wrong:

-Mozart didn't die on a morning with Salieri on his sidebed, after spending all night working on the requiem. He was with his family and passed away after midnight.

-Mozart was left handed.

-Mozart did make a few sketches and drafts. These were minor, but he did make a few of them.

-Mozart did not collapse during a performance of The Magic Flute.


Some misinterpretations:

-The film suggests that Salieri envied Mozart. While this may or may not be true, people interpret that the two had an unfriendly relationship, which wasn't the case. It wasn't like they were best friends, but it also wasn't like they were enemies.



There's this chess player, Capablanca, who was nicknamed "The Mozart of Chess", because he had quite a fair amount of similarities with Mozart, such as the fact that he was also a genius with photographic memory. He self-taught himself chess at age four, and by the time he was a teen he was already a world class player. He was world champion for six years and at one point during his career, he went on an eight year undefeated streak. That is eight years without losing a single game of chess. Never before or since has this fact been ever seen, not even on a "one year undefeated streak". This guy went EIGHT !

Apparently, Capablanca was also like Mozart, meaning he rarely read any chess books, hardly prepared for his matches, instead enjoyed being a ladies' man and playing bridge and dominoes with his friends, yet when it came to the board, he was just impossible to beat. So he also had that gift Mozart had.

That's the message and the purpose of the film, and not to serve as a documentary biographical movie.

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[deleted]

The movie is a symbolism to represent the differences between raw talent and mediocrity.

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-The film suggests that Salieri envied Mozart. While this may or may not be true, people interpret that the two had an unfriendly relationship, which wasn't the case. It wasn't like they were best friends, but it also wasn't like they were enemies.

In that case, why not just use fictional characters?


Because it's a way to pay tribute to one of the greatest composers of all time, plus guys like Mozart, Newton, Einstein, Gauss don't show up every five years. Those were hardcore actual geniuses.

Like I said, most great composers wrote 100-150 pieces in their lifetime. Mozart wrote +600 in 30 years. He wrote 41 symphonies, when nomally it's about 10-15. He wrote over 30 operas.

It may not have been Salieri, but I guarantee someone during his time must have been quite envyious towards Mozart's talent.

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[deleted]

They could have, but then how many people would have showed up in the theatre to watch the life account of a fictitious musician? And besides, what music could they have possibly used? Not everybnody could compose like Mozart.

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[deleted]

While it is true that Mozart composed many more works than Beethoven I think that has more to do with the function and perception of music and musicians in their respective times. J. S. Bach considered himself more of a craftsman than an artist and composed over 1000 works in his lifetime. Mozart's friend Haydn composed over 100 symphonies alone. In the romantic era musicians were less dependent upon patronage, had more power and prestige, and therefore didn't need a prodigious output of music.

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Touching the functions of music, it is also to Mozart's great advantge that he composed a huge variety of music and was such a master in dramatising human relationships and emotions that you can easily find something of his to adapt for films.

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Or, they see The film, get Interested in The subject and look it up for more info, thus discovering something new..

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...discovering something new...(and HOW)

Like me, I wonder who else had gone through most of their life hearing something by Mozart and just saying--

"That classical music stuff, it's good, sure, but it all sounds the same."


THEN I saw this movie and realized I might want to rethink my attitude about classical music in general, and Mozart's work in particular.

I think it was that snippet of the D minor piano concerto they play on the soundtrack that got me hooked, something about it just 'moved' me like no music before ever had. Powerful stuff.


So I for one can safely say my musical tastes were broadened by this movie, no matter it's historical inaccuracies. And I might never have heard Mozart's music except during elevator rides if not for this movie!!







"Go back to your oar, Forty One."

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Agree.

I wasn't offended at all by this film.

I think it opened up many people's ears and eyes to music they might not have otherwise thought to give one listen to.

It's not meant to be a documentary either.

I like this movie very much -- love the acting (except for 'the laugh'), the costumes, the sets, the music...






"I will not go gently onto a shelf, degutted, to become a non-book." ~ Bradbury

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Is there any film out there which is an actual story of the real Mozart's life and death?

No Day But Today. Today 4 U. One Song Glory.
How we gonna pay last year's RENT?!

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I am sure that the true life story of Mozart would be much boring than 'Amadeus'.

Amadeus did not win 8 Oscars for nothing!

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You're wrong. It would not be boring. Absolutely not. Mozart's life story is way too interesting.

No Day But Today. Today 4 U. One Song Glory.
How we gonna pay last year's RENT?!

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There is a reason why I said that earlier.

'Amadeus' is a wonderfully directed and perfectly casted movie.

I guess those who who have seen "Immortal Beloved (1994)" would agree with me. "Immortal Beloved" is not a bad movie about Ludwig van Beethoven, but it doesn't have the artistic beauty that "Amadeus" has.

I agree that Mozart's life story may be interesting than Amadeus, but there is only a slim chance that the movie would be.

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Movies are not meant to be history lessons. They are stories. And with any historical account, the actual events need to be changed to make an entertaining story. I never watch a movie thinking the events depicted are actually what happened. Sadly, there are those who do, but the nature of movies should not be changed to accommodate them.

All glory to the Hypnotoad

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[deleted]

What's your opinion of Amadeus as a film? If you liked it, do you feel that its historical claims are essential to its dramatic effect?


It's a film.

Pick your life for example: I bet if someone was to make a movie about your life, without adding a bit of drama, it would be boring as hell. The same applies for Amadeus.

Yes, Mozart probably didn't fart while goofing around the piano on a party, nor he probably goofed around his girlfriend at a private concert for the Salzburg's Archduke, but it's fun to imagine if he had done it.

Most of what's shown in the movie either did happen or was a very close resemblance to the truth. Either way that's not the point.

And by the way, my opinion on Amadeus: it's one of the best films of all time. The acting (especially F.Murray), the direction, everything is superb. My favorite scene is the whole "radio scene". When Constanze visits Salieri, he starts reading the compositions of Mozart and he "hears them" in his mind, and in the end he pulls down his crucifix and tosses it in the chimmeney. Chilling to this day.

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I don't think they will ever have a biopic or historical film that will be 100 percent true to life. That is why they are "based on" true accounts. Some other films that take leisure with history include Braveheart, Lincoln, Titanic, The Last Emperor, and all of them won Oscars.

That's my opinion and I'm sticking with it.

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Right. But they'd never win the "history Oscar" if such prize existed.

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That might actually mean something if you were talking about a documentary.

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Keep in mind the movie is as much about the source and nature of creativity as it is about Mozart's life. Yes, there is LOTS of license with reality, as inevitably happens with any movie. But the audience is expected to ask what the movie is intending to convey--and there are lots of contextual clues that the intent of the movie is to discuss the nature of creative genius. Salieri asks this question constantly: how could such genius--a gift of God--be given to one as vulgar as Mozart? And in the end, Salieri thinks he killed Mozart from overwork, not literally from poisoning him or kniving him or someother physcial attempt at murder.

So to ask whether any movie accurately reflects reality, ends up missing the symbolic, anagogic point of the movie as aesthetic. Or to think of it another way: "Was there such a person as Ivan Ilyich? " That ends up being a silly and fatuous question and misses the symbolic, anagogic import of Tolstoy's "Death of Ivan Ilych."

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And many incidents in the movie are documented in MOZART: HIS CHARACTER, HIS WORK, by Alfred Einstein, Oxford University Press, 1945. (Translated into English by Arthur Mendel and Nathan Broder.)

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We need a Ken Burns documentary. Maybe he can put a Civil Rights spin on it. Throw some Baseball and Lincoln in.

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