MovieChat Forums > The Winds of War (1983) Discussion > detailed historical questions (SPOILERS)

detailed historical questions (SPOILERS)

posted 15 years ago by ib011f9545i
9 replies | jump to latest

This mini series provides a sequence of events in World War 11,it covers a lot of history.

But individual scenes make me wonder if they are invented for dramatic effect.

For example,while I don't doubt the scenes of the German invasion of Poland I wonder if the Germans were so interested in American jews in September 1939 that they would risk America's anger by abusing American citizens who happened to be jews.

Another scene that annoyed me was where the Polish soldiers took Byron's passport.
We knew he was a neutral American but it seemed fair to me that the Polish army would be worried about sabotage and spies when they find an foreigner in an obscure part of western Poland.

[–] EmilMuzz 15 years ago

I think it was more about little people abusing their authority without really considering the consequences for harrassing Americans.
With the Germans, it would usually end with the German thug taunting the American, but then getting chewed out by a superior. This happened a few times- when the US ambassy people were detained in Poland, during the scene with the fat waiter, and the part where Byron beats up the O-Solo-Mio guy. Those confrontations ended because a German superior stepped in and told them to knock it off.

The Poles had no order or chain of command, so it was just a few a-holes abusing their power and not being held accountable. Good Poles, bad Poles.

If you are unable to tolerate people who don't agree with you, you are not tolerant.

[–] ib011f9545i 15 years ago

I am guilty of being too critical.

I know it was a popular drama not a historical piece but the people who made this make much of how much research they did before making this but then they put scenes like this in which weaken the whole thing.

Do you think the Polish soldiers are meant to be anti semetic?

Another factor would be that America was a much more important military and diplomatic power in 1945 than it was in 1939,which in a way is the story of this mini series.

[–] Scab16 15 years ago

You do realize it was a Herman Wouk novel before it was ever a mini-series right? I recommend you read the books. They are much better than the live action....

[–] Stevicus-2 15 years ago

Do you think the Polish soldiers are meant to be anti semetic?

It stands to reason that some of them were.

Another factor would be that America was a much more important military and diplomatic power in 1945 than it was in 1939,which in a way is the story of this mini series.

I think that America was important in the sense that the Allies wanted to get America into the war much sooner than we actually did. Memories of America's involvement in World War I were still recent in people's minds in 1939, and America's large population and industrial might were well-known. Due to geography and our distance from Europe, America was regarded as a non-factor in the Germans' eyes, but they also didn't want to give us any excuses to go to war either.

I think it was summed up early on in the miniseries when that German naval officer said that in WW1, the Germans "were doing fine, until the Americans got into it." I don't know if that was just some patronizing for Pug Henry's benefit, but I think that the Germans wanted to keep America neutral, at least at first. So, they seemed intent on reining in anyone who seemed to want to start some sort of incident. Later on in the miniseries, Hitler was seen ordering his U-boats to stand down after his little tirade against Roosevelt. "He's trying to provoke me!"

As for the Polish officer in the scene you mentioned, I was always slightly curious about that myself. It could be that maybe he really did think that Byron was a spy pretending to be an American. Initially, they said that they wanted to take their car, so maybe he was hoping for a bribe or to try to get whatever he could get. It's hard to say.

What baffled me more about that scene is that when he gets back to the car, he says "Let's get out of here" and the soldiers just let them drive away without even trying to stop them.

[–] generalusgrant 15 years ago

I'm a big fan of Winds of War, but the historical inaccuracies are mind-boggling. It's patently absurd to think that a minor Naval figure like Pug would have private audiences not only with FDR, but with Hitler, Mussolini, Churchill and Stalin. It's laughable!

And of course no SS Man would harass an American Jew, there wouldn't even have been any SS present during the exchange.

Furthermore, if you look forward to what eventually happens to Natalie Jastrow, NO AMERICAN was ever in a concentration camp. They have her barely surviving after years of being in a camp. Another historically inaccurate bit of nonsense.

The actors portayed Hitler were also inane. Hitler was nothing like the maniac shown here.

[–] BertramWilberforceWooster 14 years ago

Winds of War isn't meant to be history in the typical sense. Wouk wanted to create a grand romance using one family. Yes, it is stretching belief, but that's called FICTION.

There were a few Americans who stuck in Concetration camps. Not many, I will grant you, but a few. If you read Auschwitz by Laurence Reece, he even discusses the few Americans who died because of disintery. Like Natalie and Aaron, they had the misfortune of being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Actors are paid to do a job. The person who played Hitler are liked or disliked for different reasons. I liked the person who played him in Winds because he was much more realistic and Steven Berkhoff (who just over-acted through-out Remembrance).

--
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
jonbkennedy.wordpress.com

[–] jamma_man69 14 years ago

the part of the German soldiers removing all the foreign jews is taken from historical records. After the invasion of poland--the Nazis high powers gave the order all jews--regardless of nationality wher to be segragated. it should be mentioned that in the order--it covered. Blacks, gypsies and other undesirables

[–] Havan_IronOak 14 years ago

As far as temporaly unbelieveable scenes...

When Pug goes to NYC to see his daugher, she invites him to see radio show with a comic that makes $15k per week.... The segment of the radio show that we see ends with a seltzer bottle chase. I know that it's important to be visually interesting for the mini-sereis but how would that have played on the radio?

It just seemed weird. They could have include a hundred different things that might have worked better.

It's been years since I read the book. Does anyone recall if that scene was in the book?

Separate question. The Swedish Ambassadors car that Byron, Leslie and Natalie travle in to view the Warsaw evactuation route bears a digraph emblem that has the letters CD in the oval. Sweden is SE now. Was it something else before?

[–] Stevicus-2 14 years ago

Separate question. The Swedish Ambassadors car that Byron, Leslie and Natalie travle in to view the Warsaw evactuation route bears a digraph emblem that has the letters CD in the oval. Sweden is SE now. Was it something else before?

I'm not sure, but I wonder if CD in this case stands for "corps diplomatique," since it's a diplomatic vehicle.