Nicodemus knew about it.


About Nicodemus, I think he knew what will happen.
When Ms.Brisby entered the rat rosebush Nicodemus sayd "Yet Mrs. Brisby will serve the rats of Nimh far more than we for her." from this I understand after I saw the movie that she will volunter to drug the cat, Dragon, and she will be capture, so she would listen when the man speak on the phone that the scientists from Nimh will come after the rats.
Also there is a scene that shows Nicodemus knew that Mrs.Brisby will help the rats of Nimh, more than they would help her.
When Nicodemus and Mrs.Brisby are on the boat, Mrs.Brisby wanted to tell Nicodemus somthing about Dragon, but she hesitated. Then as she leaves, Nicodemus stays motionless, waiting for somthing. And yes, she return's saying "I volunter, for Dragon".
Well what do you think? I thought it is interesting to talk about this :).

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You know-watched this movie many times, and I think you have a point...
I think he did know, not only was he smart for a rat, but like he had a "sixth sense" about things.

But, if he knew about Mrs. Brisby, why would he let Jenner plan his death without doing anything about it? Or did he accept it as "Whatever will be" kind of thing?

Cheers-
Chell

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I realy think that he accepted the fact that he will die, and Justin will fight for the good of the rats of NIMH to make way for Nicodemus plan to arrive at the Thorn Valey. In other words, he sacrifice himself for the good of his kind.

"Heaven sent these wings were meant to prove once more, that love is the key"
Flying Dreams

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Maybe this is looking too much into things and it was just to save animation work but when he's looking at Jenner through that machine he has, that's him talking about setting up an "accident" with another rat for the first time.
Maybe he could tell the future...?

It was probably just to save more animation work though imo.

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I think you're right, it doesn't make any sense why they'd have all this fantastic animation but go cheap for those few seconds. I've seen this movie so many times and that part has always bothered me. You could be right that it was just to save money but it just doesn't really fit in with how much painstaking detail was put into the animation. But who knows..

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in my experience, people who see into the future often have a ?bound by fate? mentality.and so they do nothing, believing they cannot change what will happen.

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There is the long held belief that psychics can clearly see the future of those they encounter, but can't see their own future, so rather than feeling "bound by Fate", Nicodemus likely doesn't know it's his own death Jenner is planning.


I DIED IN EPISODE 81!!!

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that has always bugged me! i picked up the first time i ever saw the film that the scene where Nicodemus is saying, "jenner, i fear, may do her harm...." and you see jenner through his magic *gah* sphere thing, that's from the scene later on where jenner is telling Sullivan "accidents could happen" and he starts formulating his plan to kill Nicodemus. it always bothered me because i thought they didn't want to take the trouble of drawing an original bit of jenner for that, but now it bugs me because it seems to be more magic.



"No, sweet lady, you are welcome here." - Justin

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I highly doubt that Bluth would bother to "save animation work" by doing that. If he wanted to save money, he just would've made a crappy animated film to begin with. But hey, anything's possible...

Also, going back to the Nicodemus knowing he was going to die...my guess is that he probably did know beforehand. If you think about it, him getting killed by Jenner brought to light Jenner's intentions, which may have proved disasterous to the rats if they found out about him later. It also provided a chance for Sullivan's redemption before his death, by helping Justin out with the sword and ultimately saving Justin's life by killing Jenner.

Nicodemus' foreknowedge of his death may have been why he gave the amulet to Mrs. Brisby so early, so it wouldn't fall into Jenner's hands. Not sure about that, though.

-------------------
jaynumber13.net

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Don't you think Nicodemus may have given Mrs. Brisby the amulet because he knew she would use it to move her house? Maybe he knew Jenner would sabotage the machine, which would drop the house and kill him as well. Because he knew that Jenner would have destroyed the machine and killed him, he gave Mrs. Brisby the stone to use to move her house.

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Doesn't he mention that Jonathan wanted her to have the amulet when he gives it to her?

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[deleted]

Self fulfilling prophecy is that someone convinces you so much in believing something, or you somehow just believe something will happen, good or bad, you end up supporting - or even cause it, to happen. Even if you fear it, or shall we say, ESPECIALLY if you fear, or resist, an until-then imagined "outcome".

If you decide to do something else though, nobody can "force" you to experience the exact outcome that someone has "prophecised" about. Ie. someone "prophecise" you will have a car accident in October, you just stay alert and watch the traffic, and generally stay out of heavy traffic. No car will ever meet you in accident, because accidents will mostly happen when you are not alert!!

In fact, staying alert at all times (not fearful, but alert, aware and relaxed, feeling the body and mind), is actually a healthy activity, which will gain you keener insights and stay out of trouble. This can be said to be a practice of yoga (union with spirit, mind and body). It can be practiced at any time, during any activity.

Just believing someone else's words as truth is irresponsibility. You have to feel how it resonates with your own being, and your own DETERMINATION.. If you don't believe it, nothing will happen. If you feel this is daunting, do as the miltary chief's son: Grow some spine! Life is as tough as your unwillingness to deal with it..

But some people let others dominate them with feelings of fear and uncertainty. Many people let others give them prophecies or curses based on fear and hate, and then be ruled by such words, against themselves or an imagined "enemy". It is very low vibrational truth. It can only happen when people are easily swayed by fear, anger and domination, to be ruled by others in this way. It happens all the time, even in "civilized society". We have examples of this abuse every year, every day. Some people actually crave to be dominated and be "told" what to do, what to think, in various levels! So it is quite natural even. We wouldn' have military or police, if nobody craved such experience.. These people are needed too, but we shouldn't lose sight of our awareness through it all..

As a group, we also let others manipulate our feelings quite often, phrases like "the other team", "good guys vs bad guys", "boogies", "charlie" or even "foreigners" (who in America isn't a foreigner?) At some point it becomes mere semantics though and not that important.


Now I will share something of my own experience, where someone through email, with nothing more than my name and birth time, has done a reading on me using astrology and intuition. 20-30 pages with details about my personality, intimate details about my life, opportunities for the next months and years in relation with personal planetary cycles.

Not one line of that report I can pinpoint something which was not true already in some fashion, or did not come to pass in the last 5 years. However, it was also ALL positive and constructive, even the "negatives", or "criticism". The person behind it very loving, wise and skilled - which is very very very rare. So it is possible, but only when used for good, not for fear or hate. It didn't say exactly when things would happen, but more on when the energy was high, during which the possibility of it could make it more likely to happen in the future - if I worked along with it at those times, in a roundabout fashion, not that exact times matter that much.

Also, not to be used all the time or just out of curiosity. Because we usually need to decide our lives for ourselves, not by others. But at certain times, other people can point us where the road ahead lies - especially when there are difficult roads we otherwise wouldn't want- or even see clearly enough, to take.

Even when it's all 100% true, its also important not to get stuck with it. Because it'll never be truly 100% true. No action in this world is absolute, or 100.0% perfect. Maybe its just what you need then and there, if it is positive. The negative stuff is other people's garbage, you don't have to accept it at all.

However, I feel I *could* have chosen the easy way out. I could have NOT moved to another country, NOT taken another job, NOT done this and that, but I would have missed out of the biggest events in my life if I hadn't! It all came to me unasked for, and fit perfectly with what I was already doing, but I also had to do some things for it to happen. The astrologer told me I had to work for it. So it was both "self-fulfilling prophecy" and "potentials unasked for" at the same time! In the end, even though I lived through it, it remains a mystery of life. And that's a good thing!

Also, even though something is "meant to be". It doesn't have to be 100.0% perfect, as we percieve it. It just may be something that needs to be expressed, but it doesn't mean the sun will go down the horizon and the hero go down with the sun.. Life continues, with twists and turns.. NOW WHAT.

If you can take this knowledge and make someone's life better somehow, so much light will shine more brightly in your own life also.

About the magic in the movie. The movie "flows" so much I wasn't bothered at all by it, and I'm not really bothered about magic in general. But to me, life itself contains so much "real magic", that most people miss out of, being so preoccupied in their minds, or being too sceptic. But it remains a dessert we can enjoy more of at a later time I guess. I've had some small tastes though, and I know much is true which sceptics "debunk", but there are also lots of dogma (on both sides), wishful thinking and lack of experience / sharlatans out there.

Why Ms Brisby was so intelligent, how the mice could read at once, the owl etc.. Yeah, noticed all that. I also feel Nicodemus is a stereotypical passive prophet. But maybe he was Enlightened, and just saw that this was the best continuation, for him the end this way, and accepted that.

Would be beautiful if it was. But I generally dislike doom-and-gloom and passive prophets, that somehow think the future is set in stone. THAT is self-fulfilling. But it CAN be accepted as the best future for all, and that is beautiful, as I see it now at least ;)

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