MovieChat Forums > Space: 1999 (1975) Discussion > No Alien cares about the MOON?!?!?

No Alien cares about the MOON?!?!?


I hate this series. (Yes, I have enough time to write about it too).

From what I know - forgiving everything else about the concept - no alien race even questions the fact there is a moon shooting through space.

Put this in any other science fiction universe. Any given ship comes across a MOON that's hurtling wildly through the cosmos - isn't that enough to warrant a question?

KOENIG: We are from Alpha!

BOOGA: Wait, are you on a moon?

KOENIG: Well, yes, but my people...!

BOOGA: What's wrong with you?!?!

The episodes I've seen show the Alphans otherwise being as content as can be. What's worse on being on Alpha as opposed to being on Hawaii?

"I live the unknown, I love the unknown, I AM the unknown."

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One thing - without a planet to orbit, how would aliens know by looking at it that it's actually a moon, and not just a small planet?
If those are season two episodes you're referring to about the Alphans acting content being on Alpha, you're absolutely right. I've been a hardcore fan since "Breakaway" premiered and that has always been one of my complaints with season two.

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Mercury's not much bigger than the Moon, and no one blinks at calling it a planet. Mars' gravity is less than half that of the Moon, and it, likewise, is secure in its planet status.

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I know this is very late, but: whatever gave you the idea that Mars's gravity is less than half that of the moon? The acceleration of gravity on Mars is about 3.711 m/s(squared) (slightly more than 1/3 that of Earth). The acceleration of gravity on the Moon is 1.62 m/s(squared) (approximately 1/6 that of Earth.

The size of the moon relative to earth is pretty large compared to most systems we know about. I have heard some posit that the Earth-Moon system should be considered a double planet system. There are, of course, other moons in the solar system large enough to be considered planets.

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Wouldn't it have to be a moon rather than a planet, especially not their HOME planet, if they have to be in pressurized buildings etc in order to survive?

I suppose an atmosphere wouldn't last very long without a sun in any case, but still.... with all the craters and stuff, I sure wouldn't guess "planet."

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Look at the Earth on "Journey To Where". No craters, but still...

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Wouldn't it have to be a moon rather than a planet, especially not their HOME planet, if they have to be in pressurized buildings etc in order to survive?


Not if the Moon had once been able to support life, but an ecological disaster stripped away its atmosphere. And any aliens that encounter the Moon have no reason to believe that's not the case.

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But even at just a casual first glance, all of those craters are pretty old.

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I imagine Mercury's surface looks similar.

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Actually Mercury is so hot, I doubt things like the craters on the moon stay like that for very long.

But the main thing is, they're both long-time lifeless bodies. Why would any aliens figure that the moon was any kind of previously life-sustaining planet OR moon, that they humans there "belonged" on naturally?

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You're right, I was just saying they wouldn't know it had been a moon. I wouldn't think they belonged there naturally either.

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Who says the craters and the ecological disaster have to be related? Or, for that matter, that the disaster that forced these people to live in artificial environments had to have happened recently?

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The point was that the un-eroded craters would show that there hasn't been an atmosphere for a long time, far longer than those artificial structures could have supported life, and there would be no sign of any previous structures they had inhabited previously, or any evidence of factories etc used to build the structures in the first place, and there's those big explosion pits on the far side...

Actually it's kinda strange that the explosion areas were never even mentioned again in the show, let alone shown. They really should have been.

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We've never seen it up close since the pilots have had no reason to visit the area. The other waste areas weren't at that location (the one on "The Seance Spectre" was the first one built, probably the closest to the base, and the one on "Bringers of Wonder" was constructed after the disaster).

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Among other things, they could go do some research to see if there might be some way of duplicating the process to get back home. Or at least to put the moon into a stable orbit in another solar system so they could have time to do a proper colonization of a suitable planet.

Not that they ever would really do it, or at least not successfully, since that would mean the end of the series. But it's something that could have been mentioned as being looked into.

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They successfully changed their course on "The Seance Spectre" to avoid a collision, but to use the same technique to move closer to a planetary body would be a bit risky.
The waste area presented on "Bringers of Wonder" must be fairly close to the base since it was stated that detonating it would destroy them.

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Move that waste to a safer area then, and maybe lay it out so that it's more rocket and less explosion. It would at least give them something to do as they while away the weeks between solar systems.

Or maybe since they can no longer get pure reactor fuel from Earth, Bergman figures out a way to reprocess the waste and get more fuel out of it. Something that wasn't done before because it wasn't considered "cost effective."

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Since Bergman died less than a year after the moon was blown away (according to Helena's status report on "The Metamorph", which contradicts some season one episodes), he might not have had enough time, or enough built-up waste, to achieve those experiments.

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Maybe not enough built-up waste from their own power generation since the start of the show, but if that other disposal area had enough in it to destroy them if it were detonated, that seems like enough to start work on reprocessing it into new fuel.

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The domed waste area seen on "The Bringers of Wonder" that was built after they had left Earth was the one that would've destroyed them if it had been blown up (why they'd have it so close to the base is beyond me). The amount of waste contained would've been much greater than it had whenBergman was alive ("Bringers of Wonder" took place 5 1/4 years after they'd left Earth, although there is a continuity error - part one was said to have been 1912 days after they left Earth while part two was 2515 days after they left Earth, which would've been 106 days after "The Dorcons", the final episode).
The waste area detonated on "The Seance Spectre" was presumably the one they would've used on "Collision Course" if they hadn't opted for the nuclear mines to implement "Operation Shockwave".

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Wouldn't it have to be a moon rather than a planet, especially not their HOME planet, if they have to be in pressurized buildings etc in order to survive?

Not if the Moon had once been able to support life, but an ecological disaster stripped away its atmosphere. And any aliens that encounter the Moon have no reason to believe that's not the case.


There is a little something called mathematics that scientists use a lot. And mathematically the premise of this show just doesn't add up in many different ways, though I have enjoyed many of its episodes anyway.

Anyway scientists have calculated that an astronomical body with the escape velocity of the moon would lose an Earth like atmosphere in just a thousand years. Since the average celestial body is millions of times older than a thousand years, the vast majority of celestial bodies with the escape velocity of the moon will be airless even if they ever did have an Earth like atmosphere.

So any aliens who become aware that the Alphans breath air and need a thick atmosphere will quickly realize that they originated on a larger planet and colonized the moon.

So any aliens who note the diameter and mass of the moon will be certain that inevitable processes stripped away the atmosphere of the moon millions of times faster than intelligent oxygen breathing beings like the Alphans could have evolved on it, and thus be certain that the Alphans come from a world with much greater escape velocity.

Aliens should not be interested in whether the moon was a moon or a planet. Instead they should be awed by the immense forces that could give it such a great velocity as the show's story requires.

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The aliens could've reasoned that the moon's parent planet had been destroyed, which sent the moon on its journey.

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The aliens could've reasoned that the moon's parent planet had been destroyed, which sent the moon on its journey.


But natural process can't hurl a planet or moon out of a solar system at relativistic speeds. If the moon is traveling fast enough for time dilation as several posters mention, or to pass a new solar system once a month without time dilation, it will be travelling many times faster than any natural interstellar planet sized object and thus be very interesting.

Note that the Moon would still rotate once every 27.321 days, which would indicate to aliens that it had probably been tidally locked into synchronous rotation and orbited its primary every 27.321 days.

The Earth-Moon system has an average orbital speed around the sun of 29.78 kilometers per second and the Moon has an average orbital speed of 1.022 kilometers per second. So if Earth instantly disappeared the Moon would add or subtract (depending on where it was in its orbit of Earth) up to 1.022 kilometers per second to or from the orbital speed of the former Earth-Moon system. Thus the speed of the Moon relative to the sun would be between 28.758 and 30.802 kilometers per second.

But at the Earth-Moon system's distance from the Sun the escape velocity from the sun (or third cosmic velocity) is 42.1 kilometers per second. So the Moon would not leave the Solar system if the Earth was destroyed.

The escape velocity from the Sun is 34.1 kilometers per second at the orbit of Mars, 18.5 at the orbit of Jupiter, 13.6 at the orbit of Saturn, 9.6 at the orbit of Uranus, and 7.7 at the orbit of Neptune.

A moon that orbited Jupiter with a period of 27.321 days would orbit between IV Callisto (16.698 days) and XVIII Themisto (129.87 days) and would have an orbital velocity between 8.204 and 4.098 Km/sec. Adding up to 8 km/sec to Jupiter's orbital velocity of 13.07 km/sec could give such a moon a velocity of up to 21.07 km/sec allowing it to escape from the solar system.

If the Moon rotated every 1.7691 days like Io it could have orbited a planet like Jupiter at a distance of 421,000 kilometers and an orbital speed of 17.334 kilometers per second. thus it could have escaped from the solar system at a significantly higher speed if its primary was destroyed.

But any moon that escaped from the Solar System after its primary was destroyed would be travelling at only a few kilometers per second and would take hundreds of thousands of years to reach and pass by another star system.

Of course a moon-sized object could be ejected from a solar system with a much greater velocity if the solar system contained two or more massive neutron stars or black holes orbiting very close to each other at great speeds. Of course such solar systems are very rare and so are objects ejected from them at great speeds.

So the aliens would consider the speed of the moon to be highly unusual.

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Well, the show would've been less interesting if every episode had been a "bottle episode" with no planet arrivals.

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Well, the show would've been less interesting if every episode had been a "bottle episode" with no planet arrivals.


My point in that post wasn't about how unrealistic the premise was, but simply to point out that the speed of the moon was so many times the speed that any natural celestial body should have. Thus any aliens who detected the Moon should have found its speed highly unusual instead of thinking that it was some kind of normal rogue planet.

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Supposedly the moon kept passing through space warps and other phenomena, as opposed to having a faster-than-light cruising speed.

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Couldn't they just build a rocket motor to pilot the Moon?

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They did twice - on "Breakaway" and "The Seance Spectre".

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I don' think the Alphans were ever content living on the moon. It's too dangerous. However, they did learn to adapt by season two. They still hunted for worlds to live on but, by this time, all the near misses taught them not to get their hopes up. As long a they could survive they'd keep trying.

The moon itself is an oddity. One thing I liked about the 2nd season episode "The Taybor" is that he makes a comment that he has never seen a wandering moon like Earth's but, obviously, he's seen other things equally as interesting.

In "Earthbound" there is a wonderful moment when Captain Zantor has a rather blasé attitude about Earth's moon and their situation. It's he and his people's desire to go to Earth and be accepted by whatever or whoever is left there after the disaster. I always wondered if they made it to Earth.

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Supposedly the Caldoreans would arrive on Earth in 2074, but they curiously weren't accounting for time dilation. If they had arrived after 2120, that would explain why Dr. Logan hadn't mentioned the Caldoreans, although if Zantor had arrived prior to 2120, that may have been the basis for Logan's attempts to try and contact Alpha.

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We don't know what method of space travel they were using for their trip, only that it would take 75 years from the Moon's current location to reach Earth.

I suspect that Freiberger told the scriptwriters to ignore anything that happened in the first season.

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Exactly. As Koenig had pointed out on "Bringers of Wonder" - "We've been away from Earth for months, which in Earth terms is generations"...
So even if Zantor had a way around time dilation, it would still be much farther into the future than 2074 when he arrived.

It would seem that Freiberger produced the show as though season one never existed, apart from the moon blasting out of orbit.
The one mention of Victor Bergman ended up as a deleted scene from "The Metamorph".
There were no references to any events that had occurred on season one (besides the moon's breakaway).
Koenig and Helena had met on "Breakaway" but a whole conflicting backstory was created on "Bringers of Wonder", where Helena and Diana Morris had become rivals on Earth over Koenig.
"The Metamorph" occurred 342 days after the moon had left Earth, although "Dragon's Domain" had taken place 877 days after.
Supposedly Shermeen had collected plant specimens from every Earth-type planet they've been to, but we never saw her on "Matter of Life and Death", "War Games", "The Full Circle", etc.
The robot Brian was part of a star mission that left Earth in 1996, even though on "Voyager's Return" it was stated that the Queller Drive provided their only source of star travel at that time but was too dangerous to involve a manned flight.

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Supposedly Shermeen had collected plant specimens from every Earth-type planet they've been to


Never understood what the hell was she doing there in the first place. She's described more than once as a teenager. Even assuming that she's nineteen, Helena states that 1702 days have passed since the Moon left Earth's orbit--over four and a half years. There's no way a fifteen-year-old would have been assigned to Moonbase Alpha, even in the unlikely event that she was qualified to work there.

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That's Freiberger for you...
I can only imagine what the show would've been like if Anderskn had chosen a different American producer.

On the other hand, it's been said that Lew Grade had been persuaded to give season two the green light on the strength of Freiberger's idea of adding Maya. So if there was no Freiberger, there might not have been a season two. Talk about irony.

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These days she'd probably be considered a Mary Sue type character. She comes across as someone's self insert character from a fanfiction. We've never seen her before, yet she's the centre of the story, and is described as having an important role on Alpha.

The Space: 1999 comic Aftershock and Awe, written by Andrew Gaska, explains Shermeen's presence on the Moon as the result of winning a science contest for grade school kids. She was supposed to have been there for a only few days, but Breakaway happens before she goes home. It's probably as good an explanation as any.

The writers of the script, Pip and Jane Baker, would go on to write 4 Doctor Who serials in the '80s. I remember reading someplace that a lot Who fans considered them some of the weaker '80s Who stories.

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What you have to understand is that every script that had been turned in was tweaked (and in some cases almost totally rewritten) by Freiberger.

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Since Space: 1999 was made its become established that planets and Moon sized planetoids can be hurled out of their parent solar systems by collisions or passing too close to their sun or a giant planet. A spacefaring civilisation would know this and would have encountered several on their travels so if they observed the Moon at a distance they'd probably just note it and carry on.

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I hate this series


That's ok, your allowed to hate it. Personally I love it especially the first season, I grew up watching it.

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Aliens will not care if the moon was once a moon or a planet.

But advanced aliens who look at the moon or take soil samples of it while visiting Moonbase Alpha, etc. will make good guesses about it's history.

for example, if visual inspection is enough to tell them that the big craters are billions of years old, they will deduce that the moon was orbiting in a solar system during the early stages of solar system formation when there were a lot of planetesimals and many of them hit the moon.

So they will know that some tremendous force ripped the moon out of it's original solar system and sent it zooming through space at the speed of plot. And they should have been very curious about that.

AardvarkRatnik wrote:

Since Space: 1999 was made its become established that planets and Moon sized planetoids can be hurled out of their parent solar systems by collisions or passing too close to their sun or a giant planet. A spacefaring civilisation would know this and would have encountered several on their travels so if they observed the Moon at a distance they'd probably just note it and carry on.


But natural process can't hurl a planet or moon out of a solar system at relativistic speeds. If the moon is traveling fast enough for time dilation as several posters mention, or to pass a new solar system once a month without time dilation, it will be travelling many times faster than any natural interstellar planet sized object and thus be very interesting.

PS I always thought that the character in "Stupor Duck" was Aardvark Cratnik.

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If you're a long time fan of the series you'll know that most aliens that Alpha encounters have already learned all about them and only then have they decided to reveal their presence! Their computers usually identify the moon as the former satellite of the planet earth or even refer to it as a rogue asteroid!

Shut the door, Mary...

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