MovieChat Forums > Pat Garrett and Billy the Kid (1973) Discussion > PAT GARRETT AND BILLY THE KID WERE NOT F...

PAT GARRETT AND BILLY THE KID WERE NOT FRIENDS!!!!!!!!!!


That would be Pete Maxwell. Somebody shoot down that legend already.

Get it...shoot down...legend??..ah I crack myself up.

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Here's a quote from Paulita Maxwell:

"Pat Garrett was as close a friend as [Billy] had in Fort Sumner and was on friendly terms with every member of [Billy's] gang. When we saw Pat and Billy together we used to call them 'the long and short of it.'...He ate and drank and played cards with [Billy], went to dances with him and gallivanted around with the same Mexican girls. I have seen them both on their knees around a horse blanket stretched on the ground in the main street gambling their heads off against a monte game. If Pat went broke, he borrowed from Billy, and if Billy went broke, he borrowed from Pat...Oh, yes, Garrett and [Billy] were as thick as two peas in a pod."

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Oh do tell please...where does that quote come from?

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It can be found in Pat Garrett by Leon Metz, and The Illustrated Life of Billy the Kid by Bob Boze Bell. I've seen it other places too.

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Sorry, I'm talking about REAL history, not Boze Bell's wanna be graphic novel/fairy tale. That has so many holes in it, it's not even worth another read to remember what they were. Pure rubbish.

Haven't read Metz's book, but he's kinda looked at by researchers as the 'guy who knows a lot but embellishes', so I'll take Nolan's...a highly respected historian...word over his for now. Tho I do have the book and am planning on reading it.

In the annotated version of Garrett's book(that's the important part....it's not Garrett or Upton's book entirely...it's a dismantling/updating using facts and evidence by Nolan), he makes pretty much the definitive case for no friendship.

Belive what you will. I'm not going to waste my time on someone who uses Bob Boze Bell as a legitimate source.



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"Sorry, I'm talking about REAL history, not Boze Bell's wanna be graphic novel/fairy tale. That has so many holes in it, it's not even worth another read to remember what they were. Pure rubbish."

Belive what you will. I'm not going to waste my time on someone who uses Bob Boze Bell as a legitimate source."

As a history major, hopefully you'll see the flaws in your own logic here. I quoted Paulita Maxwell, not Bob Boze Bell. Her quote can be found in his book and a few others. Therefore the veracity of his book does not affect her quote in the slightest.

But while you're on Bob Boze Bell, kindly point out what errors he makes. I'd sincerely like to know. I won't settle for a "It's so full of holes it's not worth remembering" answer. Either discredit him or stop bad-mouthing his work.



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Funny how SoTyred never answered Samoan Bob, innit?

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What's even funnier is that Nolan (the historian SoTyred liked) praised Bell's book and even has a quote on the back cover!

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[deleted]

The quote can also be found in Robert Utley's BILLY THE KID: A SHORT AND VIOLENT LIFE.

I'm not sure why the quote isn't mentioned more often. I can only speculate as to why:

1. They might be doing that thing that historians often do, which is push against a widely held belief/myth in order to "set the record straight." Oftentimes it seems they push too far. Look at Wyatt Earp. First he was lionized by Stuart Lake, then, because of his heroic status that he didn't really deserve, he was vilified, and now we're kind of settling into a more flawed, realistic picture of the man. Since literature and film like to play up the friendship between Garrett and the Kid historians seem intent on bursting that bubble. While the portrayal of the friendship in PAT GARRETT & BILLY THE KID is likely exaggerated for dramatic effect, I do think the historians are exaggerating a little bit in the opposite direction.

2. They might put little stock in Paulita Maxwell's words because she might have been exaggerating the nature of their friendship in order to make Garrett look bad. But Garrett, in his own account, seems to go out of his way to say that he was not friendly with the Kid or his gang. Why would he do that if there wasn't some connection or at least some persistent rumors that Garrett and the Kid were a little closer than acquaintances?


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Film the American Xp version. That I would like to see because I do care about hysterical accuracy.

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You're living proof that a little education is a dangerous thing

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Then don't watch westerns, watch boring documentaries.

Nobody cares about how it really happened. Garrett killing Billy is a fixed point in time, and it's the legend that lives on.

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