In the Officer's Club scene while Hawkeye is explaining to the suspicious officer about the supposed CorporalCaptain survey, B.J. Mentions the name of jazz performer Coleman Hawkins. My question Why?
shareI fell asleep at the beginning of this episode last night so I need to re-watch it to hear the whole conversation but I know the scene.
Suspicious Officer: Well I don't like it.
Hawkey: Put down one No.
B.J.: One against.
S.O.: No, sir, I don't like it at all.
I did find this on Wikipedia:
Coleman Randolph Hawkins (November 21, 1904 – May 19, 1969), nicknamed Hawk and sometimes "Bean", was an American jazz tenor saxophonist.
Nicknamed Hawk. Maybe it was an in-joke since Hawk was the one making up the survey. I will watch the episode again tonight, though I had no idea who Coleman Hawkins was.
Oh, and one of his albums is called: Hawk Eyes ?????
I'm going to agree with the above poster. Looking up Coleman Hawkins due to the fact that he was called Hawk.
Destroying an empire to win a war is no victory and ending a battle to save an empire is no defeat
Does anyone else find the exchange between B.J. and Hawkeye a little creepy when B.J. is telling him about getting his orders that he's going to be sent to Korea? It goes something like this:
B.J.: So when we got home, our babysitter, Betty Sue, told me that my orders had come through.
Hawk: Wait, wait. Betty Sue? 18?
B.J. 16.
Hawk: (makes a face like he just creamed his pants) Ooooooh.
It didn't really bother me years ago but as a father of girls it kind of makes me cringe now. Was 16 an acceptable age to lust over by a middle age man in the 50's?
Frank Burns said he was going to turn "28 year old" B.J. into a "regular Army" kind of guy, so if the suggestion is B.J. is 28, I'm wondering if Hawkeye isn't supposed to be around the same age...... Alan Alda (born Alphonso Joseph D'Abruzzo) was 39 years old in '75, I'm thinking maybe his character was meant to be in his early 30's......hardly "middle aged"!! If you watched M*A*S*H* from the beginning, you know that Hawkeye is quite the "lothario" (in his mind, at least!), and often makes seemingly inappropriate comments to, and about women. The AGE OF CONSENT for sex in Maine, where "Hawkeye" was from, was/is 16 years old - so there was nothing (imo) creepy about it, and what I think is important to remember is the CONTEXT of Hawkeye's sexual innuendoes/comments, etc - they were extremely close to the Front Lines of a full fledged WAR - they could all have been wiped out on any day at any time, as many Allied Military folks were during the course of the Korean War. The stress, tension, dealing with horrifically wounded soldiers, knee-deep in bloody surgeries, the absolute chaos of the entire time and place.......with all that in mind, for myself, I don't have a problem with Hawk being a horn-dog!!! I know I'd rather die with a "just creamed my jeans" smile on my face, were I in such a deadly, horrific situation as there is during wartime. (imho, y'all)
Better to keep your mouth shut and be thought an idiot - than to open it and remove all doubt!
I always interpreted Hawkeye's reaction to be more, "Oooh! Too young! I better not do any more fantasizing about this!" I HOPE that Hawk, incurable letch, that he is, would at least draw the line at trying anything with a 16-year old!
shareYeah, but the thing is he has no idea what the girl even looks like. He's not picturing a specific 16 year-old. Just a 16 year-old. That's what creeped me out.
shareYeah, but the thing is he has no idea what the girl even looks like. He's not picturing a specific 16 year-old. Just a 16 year-old. That's what creeped me out.
Yeah, I think you are giving Hawkeye too much credit.
shareDon't get me wrong---I couldn't stand Hawk's interminable lusting after women & the mindset that they existed simply for his physical pleasure that went along with it. But--consider, this wasn't a 6-week, "fill-in" type program, in which "anything goes" in the content, airing on Channel XYZ in 2016; this was a successful primetime show on CBS in the mid 70s. I would assume that the producers wouldn't risk displaying the show's lead protagonist as such a pervert who bluntly manifests his carnal desires of seducing adolescent 1950s girls; at least I HOPE that's the case! I suppose it's a matter of one's interpretation of Hawkeye's reaction to BJ's line--I prefer that he falls on the side of "Good": that's where we differ.
shareKeep in mind the modern teen culture didn't really begin until the 40s/50s, you had a group of people with fewer social responsibility and more disposable income.
In the past it wasn't unusual for girls to marry at 16 or 17 or to be involved with an older more established man. Today adulthood is based on an arbitrary number like 18.
A female might be physically mature at 16 and depending on life experience have the mental maturity of a 26 year old.
On the other hand 26 year old might be physically mature but have the mental maturity of 14 year old.
Hawkeye was normal. People weren't so uptight then.
shareDon't forget, this is a man who used to read nudist magazines.
shareI can't say that I've ever read nudist magazines, but I think there's a world of difference in reading nudist magazines and lusting after a 16-year-old as Hawkeye did. Hawkeye was portrayed as a pervert, and he was.
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I blame autocorrect.
You may all go to hell, and I will go to Texas.
Hawkeye was a perv but so was Col. Blake. Remember when he went ga-ga over a barely legal hottie that also happened to be a cheerleader? He even dyed his hair to impress her - with laughable results. Shame on you Henry, you dirty old man!
shareWhat is wrong about reading nudist magazines with grown women in them?
For myself, I took it to mean Hawkeye's babysitter fantasies (don't we all have them?) were triggered and he checked to make sure she was legal and was expressing disappointment that she wasn't. The age of consent in Maine is somewhat irrelevant; this girl lived in California, where BJ was. If you don't know the laws of each state, the safe bet is 18.
You are assuming that all the women in them are grown.
shareConsidering that these magazines are apparently for sale in the United States and go through the US Army mail system, that seems like a safe assumption.
shareLet's get back to the original topic: the Coleman Hawkins line. Here's the dialogue in question, taken verbatim from a DVD of the episode:
HAWKEYE: Experimenting with a new rank: corporal-captain. We're down here
making a survey. Want to see, you know, if everybody likes it. Asking
everybody in Seoul.
B.J.: Coleman Hawkins, right?
HAWKEYE: Right.
I don't know much about Coleman Hawkins, or the jazz music of that period. But I'm wondering if Hawkins was known for improvisational jazz. You know, "winging it." If so, then maybe B.J. is implying that Hawkeye is improvising this "survey" stuff, in much the same way that a jazz musician improvises music.
Maybe that's not the answer, but it's my best guess.