I know that this movie is set before the First World War and that Jewish customs have long changed since then. When did the custom of arranged marriages die out? Was it common in Western European Jewish culture or was it more of an Eastern European tradition?
history is a battle fought by a great evil,struggling to crush a small kernel of human kindness
In the very, very ultra-Orthodox sects, they still have a shadchan (matchmaker). This only applies to the crazies such as the Satmar.
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Thank you :) What are the satmar?
history is a battle fought by a great evil,struggling to crush a small kernel of human kindness
"What are the satmar?"
A Chassidic sect.
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According to this report, they're still going on. (Arranged marriages that is)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O-Ijad7kCFU&feature=related
So the Jewish people in this movie are Ultra-Orthodox Jews?
history is a battle fought by a great evil,struggling to crush a small kernel of human kindness
I don't think so--probably orthodox though. Maybe someone who is Jewish can comment. I do know that arranged marriage were very common in the "old country" and not just among Jews. It was a business deal. Sometimes the marriages worked out surprisingly well from what I've read.
This is off topic, but didn't the Hasidic sects start around the early 20th century? I seem to have read that they were a response to the strong antisemitism in Europe at the time. I hope someone can comment--thanks!
Sorry to take so long in replying.
Chaddishim was founded by Rabbi Abraham Kook in the early to mid 19th century in what is now Poland.
Their unique style of dress stems from the wealthy landowners who had suppressed them for ages.
I think you've got your wires crossed a bit. Maybe a bit too much kiddush wine!
Baal Shem Tov the mystical Rabbi (1698-1760) is considered the founder of the Chassidic movement in the 18th century.
Abraham Kook (1865–1935) was the first Ashkenazi Chief Rabbi of Mandatory Palestine and may be considered as the forerunner of the Religious Zionist movement.
Yes, it probably was too much kiddush wine.
L'chiam!
Actually, shadchanim (matchmakers) are still quite common among all Orthodox Jews--but all they do is facilitate dates or give counseling to those looking for a spouse. Actual arranged marriage is all but extinct, however.
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How dare you call the ulta-Orthodox Jewish crazies.
shareIt hasn't died out.
shareMy cousin is Hasidic. She met her husband through a matchmaker. It was not an arranged marriage. Arranged marriages are still common in many cultures. They aren't as bad as they sound. I think you have to grow up with that concept to be comfortable with it. My friend's parents have been in an arranged marriage for almost 50 years. They are from India. His parents got to meet each other before the wedding and could have vetoed if they did not like the match. Gypsys have arranged marriages. I don't think they are allowed to date.
shareOne of my favorite books in the library where I work is a collection by Adele Geras called "My Grandmother's Stories." (It's the second edition, actually...I remember the first one with different illustrations by Trina Schart Hyman. The current illustrations, by Arnold Lobel, look very Fiddler-ish indeed.)
Each chapter features a frame story of young Adele at her grandmother's apartment, which leads into one of her grandmother's traditional Yiddish folktales.
In the introduction to one of these, Adele's grandmother talks about the matchmaking custom. I don't know if this was meant to take place around the same time as Fiddler (possibly, since Adele herself was born in 1944), but Grandma explains that the parents would choose a possible spouse and that the matchmaker would run between the families to arrange meetings. But she also tells Adele that if one of the parties didn't take to the other, the plans would be aborted and the whole thing would start over again with another candidate. So according to this, the young people had SOME say.
(Some of the other stories deal with Chelm, village of fools, a traditional location for Jewish folktales that Isaac Bashevis Singer also liked to write about. My personal favorite in the bunch is "The Market of Miseries", where a kvetch--a complainer--is taken by a disguised angel to The Market of Miseries, where the woman sees all the possible misfortunes for sale and realizes that hers are nowhere near as bad as she thinks.)
At the beginning of 20th century arranged marriages were common even among Christians. I am now 70 years old, and remember mya grandmothers saying that their marriages were arranged. And we don`t live in Transilvania :)
Apparently this tradition is being revived - TLC has a series coming up called MARRIED BY MOM & DAD.
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