MovieChat Forums > Mary Tyler Moore (1970) Discussion > Politically Incorrect scenes?

Politically Incorrect scenes?

posted 8 years ago by gpicto
16 replies | jump to latest

I think you'll agree the show has some lines & scenes that were acceptable in the 1970s, but seem controversial now.

I, personally, have no issue with any of the jokes or scenes, but I won't be shocked if some episodes soon end up edited, to avoid "offending" someone.

For example, in improvising an on-air obituary for Chuckles the Clown, Ted says he assumes Chuckles was married, adding that he didn't seem "like the other kind". And in another episode, Ted wonders if John Saxon's character could be gay, because the guy went to the ballet (with Phyllis).

And when Mary agrees to see an old flame, behind Joe's back. Ted tells her, "If you were my woman, I'd whoop ya!"

What other lines or scenes do you think could soon be excised, forever?

Marriage is between one man and one woman, to the exclusion of all others.

[–] thesnowleopard 8 years ago

They'd probably get away with that today, as well. Ted's a buffoon, so he says inappropriate stuff all the time. It's what he does. A lot of Will Ferrell's characters say similar things and he gets away with it, so I don't see why the jokes involving Ted wouldn't still work, too.

Some of Sue Ann's stuff might not fly, though she's very funny and Betty White knows how to slide it in under the radar.

Political Correctness is not nearly the barrier to comedy some comedians insist it is. There are lots of political incorrect comedians and comedies out there who still get away with it.

The Historical Meow http://thesnowleopard.net

[–] gpicto 8 years ago

To quote Billy Joel, you may be right. Your mention of Sue Ann reminds me of when Ted was reading a newspaper article about her, and asks Murray, "Have you seen the spread on Sue Ann?" And Murray replies yes, unless she's sitting down!

That's one of the racier lines the show ever had---- maybe the raciest.

But when a Ted makes such a remark in one of today's shows, you know some other character is absolutely going to balance it out with a Seinfeldesque, "Not that there's anything wrong with that.", which wasn't necessary when MTM was in its first run.

Marriage is between one man and one woman, to the exclusion of all others.

[–] Beau29 8 years ago

"Ted was reading a newspaper article about her, and asks Murray, "Have you seen the spread on Sue Ann?" And Murray replies yes, unless she's sitting down!

That's one of the racier lines the show ever had---- maybe the raciest."

Middle-age spread is someone getting heavier as they get older. Murray and Sue Ann were constantly insulting each other so I thought Murray was implying that Sue Ann was fat... and old. You wouldn't see her widening belly (spread) if she was sitting down.

It's funny and mean... but how is that racy?

[–] alanjobe 8 years ago

Lou made lots of inappropriate remarks about women's bodies. He would say things like 'caboose' and said that one woman's rear end was so firm you could crack an egg on it.

Feminists probably would have a big problem with Mary making/bringing coffee to Lou or buying presents for Lou's wife or other things like that.

Al - Alicia
An - Andrew
Jo - Joseph
Be - Benjamin

[–] thesnowleopard 8 years ago

Lou made lots of inappropriate remarks about women's bodies. He would say things like 'caboose' and said that one woman's rear end was so firm you could crack an egg on it.

Like Ted, Lou was no role model and was presented in the show as a blatant sexist and antagonist to Mary's idealistic career woman. Just because he had layers doesn't mean the show was validating what he said.

Feminists probably would have a big problem with Mary making/bringing coffee to Lou or buying presents for Lou's wife or other things like that.

"Feminists" are not some monolithic bloc. Mary, for example, was a feminist, but in the 1970s, if you wanted to have a job, especially one like that, you got the coffee and bought presents for the boss' wife. You may not have liked it, but you did it.

"Feminists" who are old enough to remember the 70s (or the 80s) would recognize that and appreciate the realism.

The Historical Meow http://thesnowleopard.net

[–] pjpurple-1 8 years ago

"Buying presents for Lou's wife" ...well on another note, I just watched the episode when Lou asked Mary to go visit Edie at her apartment, to essentially "spy" on her to see if she missed Lou or was dating again.

I don't know if you'd call it politically incorrect to use a female employee to spy on your wife or just really, really unethical! Of course it was a sitcom and it was all played for laughs. And Mary loved Lou Grant so much that she'd do anything for him.

In the real world I think most people would draw the line at that sort of outside "assignment" from the boss.

A moment that might bring on the PC police today was the sixth season episode when Mary got a little sister from the Big Sister Organization. Sue Ann did the same thing because she wanted to win a local "Woman of the Year" Award.

She burst into Mary's apartment with the line, "I have a little sister too, and she's BLACK".

The whole scene was so funny in making fun of Sue Ann. But today I suspect there would be an oversensitivity.

[–] PrometheusTree64 8 years ago

Many of the things the OP refers to, many of those lines, would still be used today, but slightly re-worded.

Some people in other threads don't seem to know that the "sexism" in the office at WJM from Lou Grant was deliberate on the part of the writers, their showing how, at the time, women were still expected to do certain things (organize parties, make the coffee, get doughnuts) despite their title (in this case, associate producer).

But convincing younger people today that writers had a political perspective 45 years ago, and that these things were shown out of sensitivity not insensitivity, can be kinda tough.

She burst into Mary's apartment with the line, "I have a little sister too, and she's BLACK".

That line is sometimes cut now. Which is ridiculous. It's not like people didn't know Sue Ann was being inappropriate in 1977, too.

--

[–] gpicto 8 years ago

That reminds me of the one where Mary auditioned for the job of From a Woman's Point of View, or something, and finishes rock bottom, in Lou's opinion.

At the end, they hire a Black lady and she asks Ted if he remembers her.

"Sure, you're the Black one."

Mildly amusing, but I doubt any show would include such a scene today, unless the "Ted" character were already shown to be racist.

Marriage is between one man and one woman, to the exclusion of all others.

[–] pjpurple-1 8 years ago

Yeah! That was a scene I thought of too!

It was a funny comment if you realized that Ted had a limited I.Q. and wasn't racist. He only saw the surface of things and that was the easiest way for him to remember that woman!

Today it would be filled with all sinister undertones of racism. Actually it was a shot at Ted for being so dumb and shallow!

[–] CarolTheDabbler (575) 2 years ago

"Feminists" are not some monolithic bloc. Mary, for example, was a feminist, but in the 1970s, if you wanted to have a job, especially one like that, you got the coffee and bought presents for the boss' wife. You may not have liked it, but you did it.

"Feminists" who are old enough to remember the 70s (or the 80s) would recognize that and appreciate the realism.

Right you are!

Judging by what I've read about the television industry, an assistant producer of any gender is more or less a gopher with a title. The Six O-Clock News couldn't afford to have both an associate and an assistant. so they gave Mary the better title in lieu of better pay.

Another very realistic thing they often portray on the show is this:

1. Man refers to adult females as "girls."
2. Man corrects himself and says "ladies."
3. Man doesn't seem to know the word "women."

That still irks me a little, but it's absolutely true to the period (and often still accurate today).

We were listening to an audio commentary tonight (for "The Six-and-a-Half-Year Itch"), and Ed Asner says that he himself was still quite a male chauvinist at that time (early second season). Which may be one reason that he does Lou so well!

[–] adamwarlock 8 years ago

The most innocent 70s series is probably un-p.c. by now. I'm of the left but some of us are way too sensitive and there are too much fake outrage.

if man is 5
then the devil is 6
if the devil is 6
then God is 7
and if God is 7...

[–] Quentin36 8 years ago

The episode when Mary finds out she is making $50 less/week than the previous person. Lou says it's because you're a woman. They knew then that was ridiculous and were brilliant to write this scene. The sad thing is 40 years later it hasn't changed much. Men still are paid more then women for the same job!

[–] madman58 8 years ago

that statement was made to cause a reaction even way back then. TODAY you would get your ASS sued off if you tried to pay a woman less for the same, EQUIVALENT work. never saw a single case of this in over 30yrs in business. if you can find a woman that can hit .300 with 100rbi like MLB she would be payed just as much.entertainment and sports are where you find the box office support higher difference in wages.

[–] Quentin36 8 years ago

Women are still consistently underpaid in equal jobs.

[–] madman58 8 years ago

NOPE, if you find a case tell them to "lawyer up". they will make a bundle.employers are afraid to be dumb enough to get their pants sued off.go ahead with the myth. i am done with it.

[–] busta_cap 8 years ago

You can refuse to believe it if you want, but the fact remains that women are paid less for the same work as men despite your denial.

http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2015/04/14/on-equal-pay-day-everything-you-need-to-know-about-the-gender-pay-gap/

"According to the White House, full-time working women earn 77% of what their male counterparts earn. This means that women have to work approximately 60 extra days, or about three months, to earn what men did by the end of the previous year. However, our own estimate, which is based on hourly earnings of both full- and part-time workers, finds women earn 84 percent of what men earn. Based on our estimate, it would take approximately 40 days, or until the end of February, for women to earn what men had by the end of last year."

http://money.cnn.com/2015/04/13/news/economy/equal-pay-day-2015/

http://blogs.wsj.com/economics/2015/04/14/the-gender-wage-gap-in-eight-charts/

http://www.forbes.com/sites/susanadams/2015/03/26/new-data-on-just-how-bad-the-gender-pay-gap-is/#5a053aa51ad9