MovieChat Forums > Ironside (1967) Discussion > Some Questions About the Pilot

Some Questions About the Pilot

posted 16 years ago by sealgirl
19 replies | jump to latest

Hi Everyone!

I was watching the pilot again a couple of days ago (it was a copy of the one shown on ITV3 in the UK - and they are notorious for cutting little bits here and there to make it fit better with time!), and there were a few things that I wondered about, and I thought maybe you could help me.

- They said that Robert Ironside was married once (!!) and she died. Is that mentioned again in the whole sereis? Are there any more details?

- What does a "Chief of Detectives" actually *do*? Did he have his own department?

- Which brings me on to ... what is Ed Brown to do with Ironside, at the start, anyway? We get a brief intro to Eve, and to Mark, but Ed just shows up with a plant and a bottle of booze, and he's in! Obviously he's a police officer, and knows Ironside, but do we get any more info...?

Thanks!

*asks, for fish*

Sealgirl

[–] sweet1310452 16 years ago

There's a flashback episode in year 2 where we see how Ironside met Eve and influenced her to become a cop- Ed was working for Ironside at the time. She helped them find a criminal who was eventually sent to the gas chamber. In the pilot it is said that Ironside had never taken a vacation until the vacation at the commissioner's farm where he was shot.

In year 2, there is an ep. where Ironside mentions to Mark that he took out an insurance policy when he was married. I haven't seen much past year 2 in many years, but I wouldn't doubt there were other references.

[–] sealgirl 16 years ago

Ah, yes! That flashback episode is Reprise, isn't it!! I like that one, I think it's up there as one of my favs. And you're right, Ed is hanging around in that one - Odd thing is that in the pilot Eve herself said she was a witness to a jewel robbery, not a murder (but then it *was* the pilot so they were allowed that!).

Ironic that when Ironside takes what seems to be his only vacation in history, he gets shot!

"Ironside mentions to Mark that he took out an insurance policy when he was married. "... don't suppose you can remember which one, offhand?

Thanks for the info, anyway :)

*thanks, for fish*
Sealgirl

[–] sweet1310452 16 years ago

It's a two part episode where the Chief is undergoing exploratory surgery that could allow him to walk again.

On a side note about that episode - there's a biography of Raymond Burr in which it is said that the writers toyed with the idea of having Ironside walk again, but Raymond Burr was dead set against it- that seems strange- if he could walk, it seems like the show would have had to end.

[–] sealgirl 16 years ago

"It's a two part episode where the Chief is undergoing exploratory surgery that could allow him to walk again. "
Thanks :)

Ironside *not* in a wheelchair - how very strange!

Thanks for the info

*replies, for fish*
Sealgirl

[–] lemonpig73 16 years ago

The two-part episode where the Chief talks about an insurance is Split Second to an Epitaph.

[–] sealgirl 16 years ago

Thanks
:)

*replies, for fish*
Sealgirl

[–] juanmonge69 16 years ago

To answer oneof your questions he was Chief of Detectives.

[–] tenement-funster 16 years ago

- Which brings me on to ... what is Ed Brown to do with Ironside, at the start, anyway? We get a brief intro to Eve, and to Mark, but Ed just shows up with a plant and a bottle of booze, and he's in! Obviously he's a police officer, and knows Ironside, but do we get any more info...?

Yes, there's a lot of information about the Chief's relationship with Ed sprinkled throughout the series. Ironside seems to have taken an interest in Ed's career very early on, and Ed is clearly his protégé. Notice how much harder Ironside always is on Ed than on the others. They're obviously very close, and they're going on holiday together in the later seasons, even before they start living together. Friends, then, but neither of them is ever likely to admit to it!

There's a lovely scene in the first season episode "To Kill A Cop", when Ed is being stubborn to a quite Ironside-like degree. The Chief gets cross with him, but Mark comments "He's your monster, you've got to love him."

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The World Is Quiet Here

[–] sealgirl 16 years ago

I've had the chance to watch a few more since I asked the question - it does seem clear that Ironside has "adopted" Ed as his star pupil.
There was a lovely bit in "Split Second to an Epitaph" when Ironside was found to be reading up on a good place to fish, and he and Ed discuss it. It was a much more human way of interacting together than we had earlier with Mark and Eve in the same episode, which was full of "angst" and worry.

I also saw a later one, the one when someone tries to kill of a friend of Ed's who's a Priest; Ironside and Ed were sitting listening to what the man had to say, and the were in <i>identical</i> position, with identical expressions!!

I'm going to find "To Kill A Cop" later on and watch that one.

Thanks for the info :)

*replies, for fish*
Sealgirl

[–] tenement-funster 16 years ago

Try to catch "Five Days In The Death Of Sergeant Brown", a two-parter from the start of season six. Ed is shot, and faces paralysis just like the Chief if a groundbreaking operation doesn't work. There's some jolly good character stuff in that story. In the same season there's also the (imho) very impressive "Nightmare Trip", an episode directed by Raymond Burr. It's mostly just Ed, but there's a very strong scene between him and the Chief at one point. Raymond Burr does a jolly good job directing that episode.

And always my favourite one to recommend - "Riddle At 24,000" from season seven, in which Ed and the Chief go on one of their periodic holidays together, only to get caught up in a murder investigation. The guest star is Desi Arnaz, the episode is extremely funny, and both Don Galloway and Raymond Burr get some terrific material. That's one to avoid in repeat showings, though, as it's edited so much it no longer makes much sense. Bloody commercials...

http://www.46664.com/

The World Is Quiet Here

[–] sealgirl 16 years ago

Thanks for that - I've managed to see a few more since I posted this question up - "5 Days In The Death Of Sergeant Brown" has some fabulous character moments. I've seen "Nightmare Trip" too, I didn't know it was directed by Raymond Burr - I obviously wasn't paying enough attention to the credits ;)

"Riddle at 24000" - I think I have seen that one, does that have a section about a boy with a duck, and Ed thinks the duck is pregnant, or did I imagine that?

I've also seen "To Kill A Cop", that was a great episode, not least for the telephone conversation between Ironside and Ed, with a shout out to "Voyage To The Bottom Of The Sea". I don't get many of the references in the show, but I got that one!

Thanks for the info

Sealgirl

[–] tenement-funster 16 years ago

No, it's not a duck, it's a merganza! ;) Yes, that's the one. Ed correctly diagnoses pregnancy, apparently being some sort of waterfowl expert on the quiet. :)

http://www.46664.com/

The World Is Quiet Here

[–] sueeastlake 11 years ago

I agree with you on "Five Days in the Death of Sgt. Brown". The exchange between the Chief and Ed after Ed's decision not to have surgery was truly moving. I think that the conversations between the Chief and Ed and the Chief and Mark are truly revealing insights into the characters.

[–] robertcampopiano 15 years ago

The "Chief of Detectives" is just that, the head of all the detectives in the department. He's one of the high ranking officers just below the Chief of Police in a large department. Most large urban US police departments have a Chief of Detectives position. It's mainly a managerial and administrative position, similar to a Vice President in a large corporation.

[–] wildbill1972 14 years ago

There are some things said in the pilot that lead to some questions about Mark Sanger in the following seasons. Ironside is told by the Commishener that He will lose his pension if he returns to his job as chief of detectives. Ironside then suggests that he become an unpaid "volunteer" consultant. He hires Mark but tells him he will have to pay him out of his own pocket - "walking around money". He later insists that Mark return to school, which he does first in night school and then he goes to law school. It is never explained how his education is being paid for. By seasons 4 and 5 Mark has become very well-dressed, but how could he afford such a good wardrobe on "walking around money"? It wasn't until season 6 that he graduated from law school and then became a police officer that he would have seemed to be able to earn a decent salary.

[–] biffot 14 years ago

Re Ed Brown & Ironside - watch the episode: 'Tom Dayton is Loose Amoung Us' - we see a flashback where Ironside is on his feet....!

Ed is a young uniformed Cop and Ironside first becomes aware of Ed as a good Cop with strong potential....

Ed's Nurse finacee is accidently killed by Tom Dayton (Bill Bixby) & it returns to the present where Dayton is about to be released back into society....

'Five Days in The Death of Sgt. Brown' was originally an 'Ironside' / 'The Bold Ones' crossover two part story.......hence the unusual opening...with E.G. Marshall & David Hartman (of 'The Bold Ones') being credited after Raymond Burr in the amended opening credits....it was made after John Saxon's character Dr.Ted Stuart had left 'The Bold Ones' & before his replacement Dr.Martin Cohen (Robert Walden) came in...thus Vic Morrow is special guest as the Third featured Doctor - Dr.Ritter - at the Dr. David Craig Institute.....where Ed Brown is being treated

Craig (E.G. Marshall) & Dr.Paul Hunter (David Hartman) being Regulars on 'The Bold Ones: The Doctors' segments...(those characters created by Steven Bochco)

Later this has been made into a two part 'Ironside' tale - tho' often shown as a feature length story.....but originally 'Part One' was on 'Ironside'...then 'Part Two' was shown in 'The Bold Ones'

[–] dblackman70 13 years ago

I've always loved the relationship between Ironside and Ed - aswell as the one between Kojak / Crocker - and Ironside is one of my favorite shows. Don Galloway is one of the main reasons I like this show. Ed and Ironside are so loyal to each other. I wish they would show all the series or release the dvd's.

[–] tenement-funster 13 years ago

I agree. There's some great chemistry there, and you can tell that the actors were friends off screen as well. The characters irritate each other at times, just like real people, but clearly have a very strong bond. I love the little side jokes about Ed gradually turning into Ironside, picking up on his habits and such like. It suggests that they spent time working little things like that out. Shows are too short now. There just isn't the time anymore to have those little character asides.

Have you seen the final season, when Mark gets married, and Ed moves in with the Chief? There are some great scenes between them then.

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[–] dblackman70 13 years ago

No, I haven't seen that season yet and I'd love to as I love Ironside and Ed. I wish they would release the dvd's so I could watch them from start to finish. I loved Return of Ironside and with all the team back together - and the Chief trying to get rid of his new wheelchair was hysterical. They just don't make proper shows like this anymore. They're so concerned with all flash, blood, gore, violence, sex and swearing - which alot of people like so fair enough - but, they forget about strong, likeable characters with real relationships and interesting stories. Shows like these may seem outdated now, but, I love them as they were able to tell good stories that kept you interested without all the flash and gore