Movies compared to Psycho in advertizing - Psycho (1960) Discussion

[–] Martoto (5054) 6 years ago

Let's just say that the producers of John Carpenter's Halloween weren't shy about the fact that Janet Leigh's daughter featured, being terrorised by a knife wielding maniac, in their movie.

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[–] MizhuB (165) 6 years ago

I remember this one from 'The Bird with the Crystal Plumage'. It was only 10 years after PSYCHO, but you wanted comparison-to-PSYCHO advertising.

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0065143/mediaviewer/rm1853547520

I have no idea when the comparisons stopped.

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[–] ecarle (14979) 6 years ago

I have trouble with links, but if memory serves....

Repulsion (1965) went out with a review excerpt on the poster: "Makes Psycho look like a Sunday School picnic."

Night of the Living Dead(1968) also had a review excerpt in its poster, I think, "the scariest movie since Psycho." (which was interesting; it just may well have been...in terms of historic impact and "landmark beginning.")

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[–] ecarle (14979) 6 years ago

I'm pretty sure that the meme was used a few times during the post-Halloween slasher boom (and I'll try to track down some examples). But my sense is that that was it; that around the time of Psycho 2, Psycho (1960) ceased to be a relevant horror landmark for young audiences, i.e., that by about 1983 too much popular horror history had piled up.

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'83, perhaps, what with the sequel coming out then.

Its interesting: though they were(I think) even bigger blockbusters than Psycho, I can't recall "The Exorcist"(1973) or "Jaws" (1975) being used in the same way with advertising.

The truth of the matter is, for many, many years, Psycho was "above and beyond" all other mainstream thrillers simply because Hitchcock got to put more on screen and in the script than any prior filmmaker -- and for years after 1960, others elected not to try to match him. (Oh, William Castle, sure -- but he wasn't mainstream.) Robert Aldrich's "Baby Jane" and "Hush Hush Sweet Charlotte" were perhaps the best-budgeted, A competish to Psycho, but "Baby Jane" had no shock murders(it had a discreet off-screen murder), and Hush Hush Sweet Charlotte had one such(Bruce Dern's head and hand are meat cleavered off) but really too much plot and overlength to challenge Psycho as a shocker.

So "Psycho" kept getting used in print ads when other thrillers did not.

There is also this: Robert Bloch, the author of the NOVEL Psycho, wrote a few horror screenplays in the 60's and 70's so the title "PSYCHO: got into those ads that way: "Screenplay by Robert Bloch, author of PSYCHO." I'm thinking Strai-Jacket, The Psychopath, Torture Garden.

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[–] swanstep (2745) 6 years ago

The main poster for De Palma's Sisters (1972) had a big ol' Psycho-comparison quote:
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0070698/mediaviewer/rm703859200

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[–] ecarle (14979) 6 years ago

The main poster for De Palma's Sisters (1972) had a big ol' Psycho-comparison quote

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This poster and the one for The Bird with the Crystal Plumage, coupled with the ones I've cited(but not shown) for Repulsion and Night of the Living Dead, help me a bit, I think, with my "My Psycho is not your Psycho" motif(meme? Mission statement?) In other words, the idea that Psycho lived on through the 60s, and then on into the 70's, as some sort of forbidden fruit icon: the ultimate in screen terror not only as a story/movie, but as an event. The film itself(Psycho) had two re-releases and various TV showings that were "special, not routine"(the aborted CBS showing; the special LA late night showings)....and, even as it made its own case for continued greatness -- informed all these OTHER movies, too.

Funny: I remember "Wait Until Dark" as a scream machine of a movie that I DID experience (TWICE) with full house audiences -- but I don't recall "Psycho" being mentioned in its advertising. Perhaps Warners did not want a major Audrey Hepburn release connected to Hitchcock's "sickening horror movie." There really isn't much blood and/or gore in "Wait Until Dark" -- and yet audiences STILL screamed their lungs out.

But this: in 1971, a much lesser blind-lady-in-danger movie starring Mia Farrow called "See No Evil" came out, and it was advertised as "a new Wait Until Dark," and I saw it and...nope. Not at all. It lacked the plush big budget of WUD; the stars, the American studio production values(it was a British cheapie.)

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[–] MizhuB (165) 6 years ago

I had forgotten about 'See No Evil'. I saw it when it first came out and thought it was boring, without an ounce of suspense.

But just for the heck of it, I looked it up on IMdB, and found this under 'Taglines':

If You Liked "Psycho", "The Birds" and "Willard", You'll Love This Suspense Thriller!

WHAT? Not only did it lack any of the suspense of those films, it was nothing like any of them!

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[–] ecarle (14979) 6 years ago

If You Liked "Psycho", "The Birds" and "Willard", You'll Love This Suspense Thriller!

WHAT? Not only did it lack any of the suspense of those films, it was nothing like any of them!

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Well, that's amazing. Reel off three hit thrillers(and Willard was from earlier the same year) that have nothing to do with this one. At least Wait Until Dark was on point with the blind angle.

One reason that movies like Psycho, The Birds, Wait Until Dark, Night of the Living Dead live on as greats is that they all DELIVERED. And it was sad when one hoped for lighting to strike twice and the result was so NOT a classic. See No Evil, case in point. I only vaguely remember the action -- a farm? Horse stables? Ah, I dunno.

"Willard" got a great little cheapo trailer(again, played locally on TV stations via wheezing projector) which ended with Ernest Borgnine surrounded by rats ("Look at all the rats!") and under attack that WE CAN'T SEE. Instead, the poster of Willard with his rat on his shoulder appeasr, we HEAR Borgnine under attack and -- we have to get out to the theater to see what happens.

"Willard" was no Psycho, but its premise was good, and Willard himself had a bit of Norman to him...living with his domineering Mother(Elsa Lancester) in a big old house, etc. The spindly, boyish lead(Dennis Christopher) was friends in real life with Anthony Perkins.

"Willard" was better than See No Evil...but not good enough to stand with Psycho, NOTLD, and their ilk.

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[–] MizhuB (165) 6 years ago

The spindly, boyish lead(Dennis Christopher) was friends in real life with Anthony Perkins.

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Just a correction. The spindly, boyish lead was Bruce Davison, not Dennis Christopher.

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[–] ecarle (14979) 6 years ago

Whooops!

Y'know...it didn't feel right when I typed it. I should have looked it up.

On the other hand, we have experts all around here. Thank you!

Yes. Bruce Davison.

Dennis Christopher, who was, indeed, friends with Tony Perkins(I have read)...was the spindly boyish lead in "Fade to Black"(title? hah) about a movie-obsessed psycho, from around 1980 or so.

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[–] swanstep (2745) 6 years ago

"Fade to Black"(title? hah) about a movie-obsessed psycho, from around 1980 or so.

I got around to watching FTB recently. It's pretty awful on almost every level starting with clunky, witless dialogue & poorly-calibrated performances. It *does* feel like FTB *could* have been saved by a rewrite & a bravura directorial effort by someone great, a young Bogdanovich or Ashby or QT say, but as it is almost every scene and key decision feels off and lands with a thud.

FTB famously completely derailed Dennis Christopher's career. He looked set for the big time after a sensational Breaking Away for Peter Yates (*all* of the other boys from that film ended up with more success). FTB's director evidently encouraged Christopher to 'go big' with Cagney & other impressions, and he ends up exposed and looking like a fool. Seeing a film like FTB is a reminder of how *vulnerable* actors are to their directors. A bad one can just *kill* you.

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[–] ecarle (14979) 6 years ago

I got around to watching FTB recently. It's pretty awful on almost every level starting with clunky, witless dialogue & poorly-calibrated performances. It *does* feel like FTB *could* have been saved by a rewrite & a bravura directorial effort by someone great, a young Bogdanovich or Ashby or QT say, but as it is almost every scene and key decision feels off and lands with a thud.

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I saw it when it came out -- the premise was certainly interesting -- but I don't remember it as any great shakes. Indeed, Dennis Christopher had just "made his name" in the charming Breaking Away, so Fade to Black got a lot of press before release . And then ----

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FTB famously completely derailed Dennis Christopher's career. He looked set for the big time after a sensational Breaking Away for Peter Yates (*all* of the other boys from that film ended up with more success). FTB's director evidently encouraged Christopher to 'go big' with Cagney & other impressions, and he ends up exposed and looking like a fool. Seeing a film like FTB is a reminder of how *vulnerable* actors are to their directors. A bad one can just *kill* you.

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Indeed. I'd have to check Christopher's credits to see what else he ever did. "Breaking Away" is the big one. HE was charming.

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[–] swanstep (2745) 5 years ago

The poster for supersnake-on-the-loose film, Venom (1981),

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0084854/mediaviewer/rm4050786816

features the tag-line:

'The mystery of "The Birds", The danger of "Psycho", The evil of "The Omen", The terror of "Jaws", Now, the ultimate in suspense.'

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[–] ecarle (14979) 5 years ago

'The mystery of "The Birds",

"WHY are they killing people?"

The danger of "Psycho",

"Don't go UP there! Don't go DOWN there!"

The evil of "The Omen",

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"There's just something not right about that kid"

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The terror of "Jaws",

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"It's EATING Quint!"

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Now, the ultimate in suspense.'

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Uh, no. Who remembers this? Still...the tagline makes a lot of sense!

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[–] swanstep (2745) 5 years ago

Now, the ultimate in suspense.'
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Uh, no. Who remembers this? Still...the tagline makes a lot of sense!

Edgar Wright remembers Venom (1981); I only watched it because it was on Wright's '1000 faves' list.

Venom (1981) is sort of hilariously terrible. It has a cast of fascinating former A-listers & eccentric cult favorites: Sterling Hayden (in his final film), Susan George, Oliver Reed, Klaus Kinski. It also has a stupidly high-concept, coincidence premise: baddies attempt to kidnap & ransom a (8 year old) rich kid on *the exact same day* said rich kid brings home *the wrong snake* for his personal zoo. The kidnapping goes wrong as the black mamba the kid didn't even know he had escapes, etc.. So the whole movie becomes the kidnappers besieged from outside by police in the kid's house while the snake picks them off inside. Sounds ludicrous and is. Maybe such a talented group of actors could have saved this premise together with the right directing and script. Alas script and direction and editing are all sub-par (Gil Taylor's crisp, Frenzy-like DP-work is the film's only redeeming feature.) Editing malpractice example: Sterling Hayden spends about 5 mins searching for the snake in a poorly lit room; the only reason to do this whole sequence is for the suspense as he looks under every table etc.; but the editor & director blew any such suspense by including a prior shot showing the snake escaping from the room down a heating duct.

Tobe Hooper was the original director of Venom but he walked/was fired (lots of different stories...) early in shooting. A deeply troubled production, the final cut seems barely releasable to me. Siskel & Ebert reviewed it back in the day:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0l_o2KiuSyg
Siskel liked it, & youtube commenters agree with him! Oh brother.

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[–] ecarle (14979) 5 years ago

Edgar Wright remembers Venom (1981); I only watched it because it was on Wright's '1000 faves' list.

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One of the things I like about Edgar Wright is that he likes "Frenzy" -- and he hosted a showing of Frenzy at Quentin Tarantino's New Beverly movie theater in West LA a few years back, I read.

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Venom (1981) is sort of hilariously terrible.

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The more you write of it, the more I remember hearing about it, though not seeing it.

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It has a cast of fascinating former A-listers & eccentric cult favorites: Sterling Hayden (in his final film), Susan George, Oliver Reed, Klaus Kinski.

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Sterling Hayden will always stand out to me. He had a lot of B movies on his resume, and an acting style that sometimes edged into the wooden. And yet...so many classics, especially in his later years: Dr. Strangelove(where his acting is GREAT; he'd lost the B-guy woodenness); The Godfather(not in it very long, but memorably shot in the throat while eating veal); The Long Goodbye(with that weird beard) and, of course, he was offered Quint in Jaws, but had to turn it down because he couldn't leave France, for tax reasons.

Then the weirdness that Hayden is in BOTH Huston's The Asphalt Jungle and Kubrick's The Killing , and pretty much in the same role(tough guy leader of a caper that goes wrong.) I swear I forget which is the one where he dies, and which is the one where he doesn't.

And Hayden's in the bizarre "feminist Western" Johnny Guitar. In a movie about dueling female gunslingers, he's got "The Girl" part.

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[–] ecarle (14979) 5 years ago

Oliver Reed: such a villain as Bill Sykes in "Oliver"; nude man-to-man wrestling in "Women in Love"(very arty); the most manly and macho of "The Three Musketeers" and "The Four Musketeers" in the mid-seventies. And I do believe he turned down the role of Richard Blaney in Frenzy(so did Richard Burton and Richard Harris; poor Hitch!) And then, slowly but surely, Reed sort of slid down to a B-movies in Holllywood career . Rather sad for him. Though his final role was in Best Picture "Gladiator" and he finished the film after his death via CGI. (He died drinking in a pub; friend Glenda Jackson said "well, at least he died with his boots on, in his favorite habitat," or something like that.) I'll remember him best in The Three Musketeers. He out-shone the other three guys with ease.

Susan George: memorably raped in Straw Dogs(unlike the women in Frenzy, she's just a little too consensual at first), and just a few years later starring in "Dirty Mary and Crazy Larry" withPeter Fonda or whatever it was; not a very long career, I guess Straw Dogs is the unforgettable one.

Klaus Kinski: I remember his intense face more than his movies; a lot of them were "foreign" and I didn't see them. He has the unfortunate fate of joining Matthau and Lemmon in Billy Wilder's poor final film, Buddy Buddy. I saw THAT one....

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[–] ecarle (14979) 5 years ago

t also has a stupidly high-concept, coincidence premise: baddies attempt to kidnap & ransom a (8 year old) rich kid on *the exact same day* said rich kid brings home *the wrong snake* for his personal zoo. The kidnapping goes wrong as the black mamba the kid didn't even know he had escapes, etc.. So the whole movie becomes the kidnappers besieged from outside by police in the kid's house while the snake picks them off inside. Sounds ludicrous and is.

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That it does. I'm reminded that Edgar Wright and QT are friends and that QT had a major scene in KIll Bill 2 in which one of the leads is bitten by a Black Mamba snake(all of Bill's assassins are named after snakes) and dies a slow death as the villainous Daryl Hannah reads some notes on the black mamba's "gargantuan" load of venom in a bite ("I like the word gargantuan," Hannah says to her victim, "and one so rarely gets to use it in a sentence.")

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Maybe such a talented group of actors could have saved this premise together with the right directing and script.

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I'm thinking that given the terrors of a venomous snake, its interesting we've never really gotten a really GOOD snake thriller, ala Jaws.

In the "B" category, I like the infamous "Snakes on a Plane" for its rather terrifying idea: snakes put aboard a plane to kill all aboard and only cop Samuel L. Jackson can save them (He yells "I'm godamm tired of all t the m'fin snakes on this m'fn plane!" -- which one led one wag to write "I'm so tired of this 'm'fn Strangers on this m'fin train!")

Also..."Anaconda"...with folks like Owen Wilson and Jon Voight getting picked off in the deep Amazon by the titular snake; it had a "Creature from the Black Lagoon" setting and some funhy/creepy deaths (the CGI snake starts the kill by clamping its mouth on the victim's head; crushes them, then ingests them' the imprint of Owen's body is seen in the SIDE of the snake later.)

But those aren't GOOD movies...just FUN movies.

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[–] ecarle (14979) 5 years ago

Maybe such a talented group of actors could have saved this premise together with the right directing and script.

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Well that was a reasonably talented group of actors...so I guess it was the right directing and script.

One of the toughest aspects of Hollywood is watching actors who are great in great films being reduced to being lousy in lousy films. Example: Young Martin Balsam as Arbogast in Psycho versus Old Martin Balsam as "comedy Arbogast" in "Silence of the Hams."

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Alas script and direction and editing are all sub-par (Gil Taylor's crisp, Frenzy-like DP-work is the film's only redeeming feature.)

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Gil Taylor! Strangelove, Frenzy, Star Wars..Venom? (Oh, well, a paycheck's a paycheck.) Note in passing: Frenzy sure LOOKS better than Familiy Plot, and rumor has it that Taylor was the "shadow director" of Frenzy while Hitchcock napped(and worried about Alma and her stroke.)

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Editing malpractice example: Sterling Hayden spends about 5 mins searching for the snake in a poorly lit room; the only reason to do this whole sequence is for the suspense as he looks under every table etc.; but the editor & director blew any such suspense by including a prior shot showing the snake escaping from the room down a heating duct.

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Hah...that would be like showing Vera Miles searching the Bates House AFTER a shot of Mrs. Bates walking down to the motel for awhile...no, wait, that would be impossible...

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[–] ecarle (14979) 5 years ago

Tobe Hooper was the original director of Venom but he walked/was fired (lots of different stories...) early in shooting.

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This was about a year before Hooper got to keep his directorial credit on "Poltergeist" even as it was rumored that producer Spielberg took over the film. A tough couple of years for Tobe Hooper!(who made his name with Texas Chainsaw, yes?)

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A deeply troubled production, the final cut seems barely releasable to me. Siskel & Ebert reviewed it back in the day:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0l_o2KiuSyg
Siskel liked it, & youtube commenters agree with him! Oh brother.

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Well, I think some of us(shamefully) are more willing to put up with the "guilty pleasure" film, in which a ridiculous plot is accepted for the purposes of enjoying the general shock-thrill ambience of the movie. "Snakes on a Plane" is like this. I mean, they went back after production and ADDED the shot of Jackson yelling about the m'fn snakes on a m'fn plane because fans asked for it.

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[–] swanstep (2745) 5 years ago

Well, I think some of us(shamefully) are more willing to put up with the "guilty pleasure" film, in which a ridiculous plot is accepted for the purposes of enjoying the general shock-thrill ambience of the movie.

I'm prepared to go along with a loopy/silly remise *if* the execution of the idea is first rate or at least shows some real zest. Unfortunately Venom (1981) is way too flaccid dialogue-wise, editing-wise, everything-else-wise to get through like that I'm afraid. I haven't seen Snakes on a Plane but I gather that it was a similar sort of disappointment... Every young director probably thinks he or she has the chops to pull off a crazy, high concept, thrill-ride a la Duel or Evil Dead or Near Dark or Point Break or Shaun of the Dead, etc. but 98% of directors are wrong about this, aren't Spielberg/Raimi/Bigelow/Wright quality.

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