As slimey as he is, I don't think this guy should have come forward - Kevin Spacey Discussion

[–] Stratego (30578) 7 years ago

Well, there have been stories about him and Bryan Singer throwing parties with minors, so who knows what else will come out. But this allegation does seem rather pointless as Spacey's actions seem not as severe compared to Weinstein's.

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[–] [deleted] 7 years ago

I think he realizes there is worse to come.

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[–] ChuckFindlay (392) 7 years ago

it does seem odd that one drunken mistake where no one was actually harmed 30 years ago is comparable to the persistent and calculated abuse of many women over decades.

New a guy that was out at a club and was talking to a girl all night. chatting up, flirty etc. at the end of the night they were about to go home together when she mentioned she was 15. He had no idea, and promptly exited the situation. Now if she hadnt of mentioned it, he would have met a girl in a club where she looked age appropriate and was in a place where she should have only been if he was age appropriate and had sex with her. He would then have been guilty of statutory rape of a minor through no fault of his own. In this same context unless more comes out, Id be willing to bet that spacey being drunk assumed rapp was of age and simply made a bad pass at the guy. According to rapp that was all that happened. A drunken over eager pass that maybe you could say was out of order but it sure doesnt rise the level of vile comments the internet is spewing spaceys way.

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[–] Cookie.L.A. (2117) 7 years ago

Does he look "age appropriate" to be hit on by a grown adult, HERE?

If you think so, you need glasses.

http://t2conline.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/562-300x167.jpg

https://img.buzzfeed.com/buzzfeed-static/static/2017-10/29/20/asset/buzzfeed-prod-fastlane-03/sub-buzz-10446-1509324661-1.jpg?downsize=715:*&output-format=auto&output-quality=auto
.

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[–] ChuckFindlay (392) 7 years ago

I’m not drunk, and who knows what he looked like at the time. An old high school photo and movie make up don’t tell me anything. I wasn’t there and neither were you. I’ll reserve judgement until I know more and not knee jerk off the back of one alleged incident where a man was refused, accepted that refusal and everyone went home not raped.

If he into under aged boys, this won’t be the only one and more will come out. No need to get all bend out of shape yet. And I say that as someone who was falsely accused by a pity girl that couldn’t take rejection.

At this point space is guilty of nothing other than very poor judgement. He owed rapp an apology which rapp got. He didn’t say rapp was lying, he said he didnt remember. He didn’t try and hide the fact he was gay to get away with it. He said if that happened it’s horrible and that he would apologise.

Where’s trumps witch hunt? Billy bush got fired for laughing with trump about the pussy grabbing didn’t he? But trump is still sitting pretty? Spacey tried it on with a young man 30 years ago and he’ll breaks loose.

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[–] Cookie.L.A. (2117) 7 years ago

<< who knows what he looked like at the time. >>

Um, that isn't an "old high school photo," it's the program for the Broadway play he was acting in at the time, PRECIOUS SONS. That's what he looked like when Kevin Spacey had him over to his house.

LOOK AGAIN: https://img.buzzfeed.com/buzzfeed-static/static/2017-10/29/20/asset/buzzfeed-prod-fastlane-03/sub-buzz-10446-1509324661-1.jpg?downsize=715:*&output-format=auto&output-quality=auto
.

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[–] ChuckFindlay (392) 7 years ago

I dont need to look again again, its a picture. It means nothing. My ex looked like she was 15 in pictures when she was 24.

You seem to continually miss the point, you and I werent there. We dont know what happened. Your angry towards rapists, molesters and abusers is clouding your objectivity. Youve condemned a man on the say so if one other. Is that all it takes is an accusation? But even if it was true and it probably is, so what? Guy said no, spacey accepted it and they went their separate ways? Is it morally right? Of course not. But no one got raped. No one got molested. No one got abused. So maybe the internet needs to came down and wait and see. Theres a couple more people coming out with stories now and they seem to be the same. Spacey tried it on, they said no and he didnt try to rape, molest or abuse them. So far hes only guilty of being too aggressive in coming on to people. Its not right, but its not rape.

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[–] Cookie.L.A. (2117) 7 years ago

No one's saying anyone got raped. But it is also not okay to pick up a 14 year old (who actually looks about 12), lay them down on your bed, lie on top of them, and press yourself against them.

It appears you haven't read the full Oct. 29th interview this report came out of. Mr. Rapp also discussed the incident in a 2001 interview, but didn't identify Spacey by name.

Anthony Rapp is a VERY well respected stage actor. He has a reputation in the entertainment industry for being kind and honest. Mr. Spacey has a reputation in the entertainment industry for being sexually aggressive and sleazy. They have both worked in the arts for over 30 years. The reputations didn't come out of nowhere.

I have lived and worked in Manhattan and Hollywood, so perhaps I have heard more stories than your average person. But the news about Spacey does NOT come as a surprise to those in the entertainment industry.
.

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[–] ChuckFindlay (392) 7 years ago

Actually people are saying that. People are saying he ps a child molester, a rapist, an abuser. As bad as Jimmy Saville, that type of stuff.

From everything I’ve heard, and you’re right I’ve heard or read everything, but from everything that’s been said spacey is as you say overly aggressive in his approach of people sexually. And while I’ll agree that’s not right, it doesn’t rise to the levels of vile that’s been produced by the internet.

And again, I say I wasn’t there and I don’t know the man. Either of them. And so I won’t believe either of them on just their words. You say you’re in that circle so you’ll know more stories than me. So I’ll ask if the stories you heard were about underage boys or just that he’s sleazy and sexually aggressive?

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[–] Cookie.L.A. (2117) 7 years ago

<< People are saying he is a child molester, a rapist, an abuser. As bad as Jimmy Saville, that type of stuff. >>

The world is NOT expected to follow my posting history...but I've posted several times that Spacey is NOT a pedophile (from this story, anyway.)

And when we have a tradition of "innocent until proven guilty", that means in the court system. In the regular world we have always made judgements based on what we've heard. I mean, we all have an opinion on the war in the Middle East even though most of us haven't been there...we go off the information we have.

I do see your point as to not flying off the handle over one accusation (like in Mr. Spacey's case, for instance.) But "innocent until proven guilty" is more about not dragging someone from their house and lynching them before a trial, not about that we're not allowed to believe something's true, given the circumstances we know (or trust).

I'll post more in a minute Re: your question : )

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[–] Cookie.L.A. (2117) 7 years ago

<< You say you’re in that circle so you’ll know more stories than me. So I’ll ask if the stories you heard were about underage boys or just that he’s sleazy and sexually aggressive >>

The general profile for him is he very aggressively pursues young men (a recent story from his decade in London has an actor saying Spacey "would grab anyone under 30") and that he is not professional about keeping his sex life off of the film set. (For instance, he can be called to the set after a break and he's having sex with someone he met on the crew, or whatever..) And, he has a really cranky, self entitled personality.

So those things aren't crimes, but you put them all together (aggressively sexual with young men, no professional boundaries, makes his own laws/entitlement issues) and then when a story that comes from a very well respected professional like Anthony Rapp comes out, you think, "Well, I'm not surprised. That guy's a CREEP!"

I don't think he's part of a Hollywood predator ring that targets boys, or flies off for sex tours of Thailand and Jamaica or something, seeking out fresh meat! But he's also ALLEGEDLY....problematic.
.

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[–] ChuckFindlay (392) 7 years ago

See that, I can believe. Because thats what its sounded like so far. Hes aggressive, sleazy, etc. Its that thing that a lot of others are saying is the part I find odd. Most child/young adult abusers dont just do it once. So Im of the opinion that in the case of rapp, it was drunken stupidity rather than a sexual preference for underage men.

Maybe Im wrong, just dont see it from what Ive seen so far. Everything else, yes. That, no. Time will tell.

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[–] Barclays (960) 7 years ago

Just because you're intoxicated doesn't mean that you forget that your coworker is a minor.

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[–] TaRaNRoD (1579) 7 years ago

Are you retarded?

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[–] Barclays (960) 7 years ago

Are you?

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[–] Cookie.L.A. (2117) 7 years ago

Your MOM'S retarded!

Fact.
.

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[–] [deleted] 7 years ago

Exactly. But Spacey was a teenager of the 70s and a lot of sex happened between people who were not of legal age, as was the culture of 'free love'.

Looking back from 2017 his actions are terrible but in that era I'm sure 14 was seen as fine if both parties were up for it. Maybe Spacey got the gay vibe off of this kid.

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[–] Catbookss (13664) 7 years ago

"But Spacey was a teenager of the 70s and a lot of sex happened between people who were not of legal age, as was the culture of 'free love'. "

Uh, yeah no. Having sex with minors always was illegal, and frowned upon. In the 60s, 70s, 80s, and up to the 2010s.

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[–] ChuckFindlay (392) 7 years ago

No it wasn’t. You need to do a bit more research. Hawaii for example only raised its age of consent from 14 to 16 in 2001.

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[–] Catbookss (13664) 7 years ago

"Previously the age of consent was 14, the lowest in the United States.

You deliberately chose the one state in the US with the lowest age of consent. However, I never mentioned any specific age to define a minor, so your point is moot.

Virtually all states in the US have close-in-age exemptions of one kind or another, specifically to make illegal sex between a significantly older person with a minor.

Haven't you ever heard the term "jail bait"? It's from either the 1920s or 1930s. It's entirely about an older person having sex with someone under the age of consent. Have sex with such a person = go to jail = "jail bait."

The "culture of free love" has nothing to do with anything, and was something from the late 60s, not the 70s in any event.

Why you're making excuses for Spacey is a question only you can answer.

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[–] ChuckFindlay (392) 7 years ago

I’m not making excuses, I’m just not losing my mind over something that was on the word of one guy. People make silly mistakes, no need to burn the guy at the cross for an ill advised pass. Trump was boasting about grabbing women and no one seems to care, but spacey hits on people overly aggressively and he’s as bad as Jimmy Saville? No chance.

As for the age of consent the law has changed over the years and has even been widely misrepresented in the media. For example California has had an age of consent at 18 for almost 100 years. But during the 70s and 80s it was thought to be much younger than that by a vast majority of the general public because of the media. There was no internet to check up on that. So you think you know the law why wuojld you bother looking at it to be sure?

As was previously mentioned it was a different time with different attitudes. Go back further to 1850 and you’ll find the age of consent was in between 7 and 10. That’s horrific, but should we really judge people in a different time? How will people judge us 100 years from now?

The point is that nothing is ever as black and white as these witch hunts make out. It’s the crime you hate, not the person. Once you know for a fact then go nuts. Until you know all the facts you’re little more than a mob ready to burn a woman at the stake on the say so of one person. Is that who we all are? Do we really care so little for people that we’ll condemn them on just an accusation?

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[–] Catbookss (13664) 7 years ago

I don't consider picking someone up in your arms, putting them down on a bed, and then laying on top of them until they manage to get away an ill advised pass or silly mistake. That's a sexual assault, just as Trump's grabbing women by the crotch is. You've got to be kidding that no one cares about that. It was all over the news and he's taken a lot of heat for it -- rightfully so.

No one's saying Spacey is Jimmy Saville.

"As for the age of consent the law has changed over the years and has even been widely misrepresented in the media. For example California has had an age of consent at 18 for almost 100 years. But during the 70s and 80s it was thought to be much younger than that by a vast majority of the general public because of the media."

I don't know where you're getting this. I'm a Californian, and was here during the 70s and 80s. I always knew the age of consent was 18. Everyone I knew knew it was 18. The time and attitudes then were the same as they are now. If you want to talk about 200 years ago, fine, that's a different story.

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[–] brux (14730) 7 years ago

Well, it is something, but I don't think a Bush-like cop-a-feel is in the same class as an aggravated rape assault. The question is, what is it? Do we need a written signed permission slip to approach anyone? Are we allowed one or two gropes followed by an apology? I think people grope each other sometimes, mostly men groping women ... mostly almost all men raping women. There is an aggression that men have looking for sex and things will happen. How serious should these be taken. If some women just blow them off and others are affects for weeks, months or years?

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[–] Catbookss (13664) 7 years ago

"I don't think a Bush-like cop-a-feel is in the same class as an aggravated rape assault."

No, obviously one's far worse than the other. It's not complicated. Most people automatically know it's not all okay to grope, grab, or touch someone in a way that's inappropriate.

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[–] [deleted] 7 years ago

Saville had sex with corpses

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[–] Barclays (960) 7 years ago

That is the worst excuse I have ever heard someone give for a child molester.

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[–] ChuckFindlay (392) 7 years ago

Who did he molest? Rapp said he made a sexual advance and stopped when rapp said no. That’s not molestation. Be better than that,

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[–] McQualude (4231) 7 years ago

Attention seeker. Thousands of worse things happen every day and get no press.

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[–] [deleted] 7 years ago

He'll probably face a backlash as well.

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[–] McQualude (4231) 7 years ago

They all will, victims or not. People might feel sympathy but will not want to hire them. Especially since all the allegations are through social media. It's just human nature.

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[–] Gastonian (946) 7 years ago

Well Rapp sees this moment regarding Hollywood as an opportunistic one. He's buying into victim hood culture and taking advantage of it. Spacey's response was also buying into victim hood culture thinking he'd get a pass. But the fact is, Rapp isn't accusing Spacey of rape, but harassment, 30 years earlier. No one knows what really happened because no one was there but those two. Spacey doesn't remember what happened and Rapp is clearly biased in how he remembers it. So of all the allegations to come out, this is the one that should be met the least amount of self righteous moral indignation and the most amount of skepticism.

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[–] Catbookss (13664) 7 years ago

Why are you saying Rapp is clearly biased in how he remembers it? Based on what? He wasn't the one who was drunk, Spacey was. Spacey didn't deny it. What he's said that is IF it happened, he doesn't remember it, and that he owes Rapp an apology as it was clearly inappropriate behavior.

All of these doubtings of (alleged) victims and excuses for (alleged) perpetrators that are coming out now is part of the problem that's allowed this kind of thing to go on for as long as it has.

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[–] ChuckFindlay (392) 7 years ago

You can blame the great many who falsely accuse for that. I was falsely accused and people like you treated me like shit even after she admitted she was lying. Take a breath and remember that there might be an innocent person on the end of your vicious judgment. And I’m speaking in general not on just this.

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[–] Catbookss (13664) 7 years ago

I'm sorry you were falsely accused and treated badly. Why you'd assume I'd do that and am making vicious judgements is beyond me, although I'm certain it has to do with your unfortunate experience.

While obviously there are some people who lie and falsely accuse others, and again I am sorry you were a victim of such a person, the reality is far fewer victims of sexual abuse report it than those that do, and even fewer who lie and falsely accuse.

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[–] McQualude (4231) 7 years ago

My experience tells me that people remember all sorts of things that didn't happen and forget all sorts of things that did. On top of that people lie. Ask any prosecutor, human memory is unreliable. That's why if a crime occurs it should be reported to the police immediately.

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[–] sleepingtiger (712) 7 years ago

Gastonian:
"Victimhood culture"? Oh,come the hell on. Rapp's been in this business since he was a kid, and is still working---there's nothing is this that's going to get him a part or anything. I do wonder why the hell he just never confronted Spacey about what happened and just dealt with it years ago. That makes no sense to me. And why after 30 years would he just all of a sudden make up something like this? Keep in mind that Spacey himself didn't deny the accusation---he said if it happened, that it was wrong and he apologized for it. However, he's clearly got some problems of his own to work out, since everything he's kept out of the public eye for years is coming out now. Heck, he's even been accused of harassing male employees on the set of House Of Cards as long as that show's even running----at least 8 employees on the show have accused him of inappropriate behavior with them:

http://money.cnn.com/2017/11/02/media/house-of-cards-kevin-spacey-harassment/index.html

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[–] sleepingtiger (712) 7 years ago

Gastonian:
"Victimhood culture"? Oh,come the hell on. Rapp's been in this business since he was a kid, and is still working---there's nothing is this that's going to get him a part or anything. I do wonder why the hell he just never confronted Spacey about what happened and just dealt with it years ago. That makes no sense to me. And why after 30 years would he just all of a sudden make up something like this? Keep in mind that Spacey himself didn't deny the accusation---he said if it happened, that it was wrong and he apologized for it. However, he's clearly got some problems of his own to work out, since everything he's kept out of the public eye for years is coming out now. Heck, he's even been accused of harassing male employees on the set of House Of Cards as long as that show's even running----at least 8 employees on the show have accused him of inappropriate behavior with them:

http://money.cnn.com/2017/11/02/media/house-of-cards-kevin-spacey-harassment/index.html

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[–] brux (14730) 7 years ago

>> Unless he knows for sure that lots of boys were abused by him, his story could have been written off as a drunken night by a 26 year old back in the 80s.

How would he ever be certain of that?

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[–] vicky_lc2001 (1907) 7 years ago

His reply was surprising indeed and seems ill advised to me too unless they were preparing for far worse.

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[–] [deleted] 7 years ago

He's a perv, and every knows of his taste for young men, even to this day on the set of House of Cards. At least these others got 26 year old Kevin. What is he now? Like 56?

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