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President of Cuba Leads Pro-Palestinian March in Havana


4 observations:

Amazing that he's completely safe while walking with thousands of Cuban citizens. What a contrast to the extremist gun nuts living in the red states making the U.S. unsafe even for little schoolkiddies.

"Bad guy" Cuba is against genocide while "good guy" U.S. supplies bombs to help Israel commit genocide.

No one on their #$@!% cellphones. Yes, they have them, but they're not addicted. They're not even taking selfies with the president.

Black, white and brown people living together in a beautiful melting pot. Not one person with a tiki screaming about being replaced.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DVYNIcA4M3U

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Cuba is purely anti-Israel/pro-Palestine because it opposes whatever the USA does, or seems to support, regardless of why.

They're also a one-party dictatorship.

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You're saying it's right to support genocide.

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I said no such thing. I simply contextualised the regime that you appear to be admiring.

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The USA is supporting genocide. Sunday, innocent civilians, including young children, in a hospital and tents were burned alive by Israelis with US support. A tenth of Gazans are likely dead. And Israel is refusing to allow all food and water into the north where 400,000 Gazans are.

You ARE saying it's right to support genocide when you criticize the march in Cuba.

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I didn't criticise it. I just said it's basically for show. Cuba doesn't really give a fuck about Israel or Palestine.

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You don't care because you're a sociopath. Normal people do care.

If you knew Cuban history, then you'd know that Cuba since Fidel has always taken the side of the oppressed and helped the poor by providing aide.

U.S. attacks Cuba because it wants them to fail to show their system is inferior. But, despite the U.S., Cuba is the wealthiest country in Latin American. They have low crime. Their children are safe. They have a high literacy rate. They have national health care!

The U.S. supported apartheid in South Africa. No surprise! Cuba was instrumental in helping South Africa get rid of the racist apartheid regime.
https://jacobin.com/2022/05/cuba-castro-angola-namibia-us-soviet-union

On some level, you must know it's 100% wrong to say one group is entitled to all land, privileges and human rights based solely on religion.

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>You don't care because you're a sociopath. Normal people do care.

Care about what? Specifically about Israel/Palestine? I follow it. I'd rather a peaceful conclusion, but I don't see how this is remotely viable in the short, or medium term.

>If you knew Cuban history, then you'd know that Cuba since Fidel has always taken the side of the oppressed and helped the poor by providing aide.

Cuba is a one-party dictatorship.

>U.S. attacks Cuba because it wants them to fail to show their system is inferior. But, despite the U.S., Cuba is the wealthiest country in Latin American. They have low crime. Their children are safe. They have a high literacy rate. They have national health care!

They're also a one-party dictatorship. They're one of the better examples of this, but they're still an oppressive state that arrests dissidents. Any thoughts on that?

>On some level, you must know it's 100% wrong to say one group is entitled to all land, privileges and human rights based solely on religion.

I don't recall ever saying anything like this to begin with about anywhere.

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"I'd rather a peaceful conclusion, but I don't see how this is remotely viable in the short, or medium term."

Easy! Start by making Israel follow international laws that they've been breaking.

Cubans have 100,000% more rights than any Palestinian.

1. There are Jewish-only streets and sidewalks throughout the West Bank where only Jews are allowed to pass. The West Bank is literally Palestinian land, but many areas are off-limits to them.
2. A Palestinian can lose their house, land and property to a recent Jewish immigrant even though they have a deed and lived there for generations.
3. A Palestinian, including a child, can be arrested with no evidence, charges, or trial and kept in prison indefinitely.
4. A Palestinian can be denied passage through numerous checkpoints for no reason which stops them from going to work, school, or even a hospital. Numerous Palestinians allowed to die, including babies and pregnant women, by being denied passage to a hospital.
5. Palestinian homes can be destroyed if someone in the neighborhood or a distant relative committed a crime.
6. Palestinian home can be entered and searched, without warrant, at any time. Anyone can be arrested without evidence or charge.
7. Torture, and death, is acceptable and routine in prison, street or at checkpoints.
8. Young college student loved chemistry so he decided to major in it at college. He was arrested and sentenced to 20 years for majoring in chemistry.
9. Peaceful marches are illegal for Palestinians as are all protests against their oppression. Writers, journalists and artists killed by Israel.
10. Israel routinely uses war weapons against Gazan civilians then promotes as "battle-tested" to international buyers who are impressed.
11. Israel denies entry of food, use of water, medicine, trade, consumer goods, etc.
12. Israel often separates families indefinitely by denying passage through checkpoints

Much more, but word limit.

Palestinians are living under an oppressive MILITARY DICTATORSHIP in an open air prison.

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Israel is a MILITARY DICTATORSHIP re:Palestinians.

Israel/Palestine can become a one-state full-democracy. Any Jewish AND Palestinian worldwide can return. Equality and freedom for ALL Jews and Palestinians in the area. Period.

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The major Palestinian groups, those that would fulfill the power vacuum you wish to exist in Israel are not interested in a democracy as you allege. Hamas and Hezbollah are as genocidal as the Kahanists and have no interest in any concept of a shared state.

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“You cannot be a terrorist when you are simply trying to defend your family, your home and yourself from brutal apartheid, occupation, genocide and oppression.”

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Yes you can. What a stupid fucking quote. Having the right cause doesn't mean you're not capable of somehow committing acts of terrorism in aid of that cause.

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Hezbollah is targeting military sites while Israel and U.S. target civilians in hospitals, schools, churches and mosques, refugee tents. Israel just killed a mayor in Lebanon. Only terrorists are the U.S. and Israel. Both are also violating many international laws.

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>Hezbollah is targeting military sites

Hezbollah also targets civilians. What the fuck are you on about? They have done for years. Suicide bombings on embassies, hijackings, shootings and continued shelling on-off of israeli territory for years.

https://henryjacksonsociety.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/Timeline-of-Terror_Membership-version_low-res.pdf

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2012? Your link is dated. LOL!!!

Israel has been targeting civilians for decades with their state sponsored terrorism. Israel drops hundreds of 2,000-pound bombs on overcrowded residential areas in Gaza where it's the most densely populated place on Earth.

If Israel wasn't breaking numerous international laws, then there would be no need for a resistance movement in an attempt to liberate the Palestinians from Israel's tyranny.

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Israel being bad doesn't mean that Hezbollah aren't also bad and committing terrorism when they target civilians, hijack planes and bomb embassies. The ideology of Hezbollah is effectively genocidal, with their media outlet in Lebanon Al-Manar propagating anti-semitic rhetoric on its programming regularly.

You are openly justifying terrorism as a good reason for retaliation.

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You're a racist who equates all Muslims with terrorism. You're openly justifying state-sponsored terrorism as well as apartheid and genocide.

"committing terrorism when they target civilians, hijack planes and bomb embassies."

Yes, Israel committed all of these acts of terrorism. They also blew-up hotels, destroyed a commercial airplane killing all onboard and blew-up an American naval ship killing many U.S. servicemen. Keep defending them!

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>You're a racist who equates all Muslims with terrorism.

When did I do that? Do Hezbollah represent all Muslims now?

>You're openly justifying state-sponsored terrorism as well as apartheid and genocide.

When did I do that?

>Yes, Israel committed all of these acts of terrorism. They also blew-up hotels, destroyed a commercial airplane killing all onboard and blew-up an American naval ship killing many U.S. servicemen. Keep defending them!

Does this mean that Hezbollah didn't do any of those things as well?

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Explain how this is democracy. Explain why you defend it.

1. There are Jewish-only streets and sidewalks throughout the West Bank where only Jews are allowed to pass. The West Bank is literally Palestinian land, but many areas are off-limits to them.
2. A Palestinian can lose their house, land and property to a recent Jewish immigrant even though they have a deed and lived there for generations.
3. A Palestinian, including a child, can be arrested with no evidence, charges, or trial and kept in prison indefinitely.
4. A Palestinian can be denied passage through numerous checkpoints for no reason which stops them from going to work, school, or even a hospital. Numerous Palestinians allowed to die, including babies and pregnant women, by being denied passage to a hospital.
5. Palestinian homes can be destroyed if someone in the neighborhood or a distant relative committed a crime.
6. Palestinian home can be entered and searched, without warrant, at any time. Anyone can be arrested without evidence or charge.
7. Torture, and death, is acceptable and routine in prison, street or at checkpoints.
8. Young college student loved chemistry so he decided to major in it at college. He was arrested and sentenced to 20 years for majoring in chemistry.
9. Peaceful marches are illegal for Palestinians as are all protests against their oppression. Writers, journalists and artists killed by Israel.
10. Israel routinely uses war weapons against Gazan civilians then promotes as "battle-tested" to international buyers who are impressed.
11. Israel denies entry of food, use of water, medicine, trade, consumer goods, etc.
12. Israel often separates families indefinitely by denying passage through checkpoints

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When did I defend any of that?

I specifically pointed out that Hezbollah is a terrorist organisation that has a long history of terrorist activities. Israel being shitty in all the ways you mentioned in the West Bank doesn't mean that Hezbollah aren't terrorists.

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You're repeatedly attacking the only people defending Palestinians against Israel's above tyranny. Why? That is the equivalent of supporting it. The U.S. and other Western countries support this ongoing genocide and tyranny which has lasted 75+ years. Both the U.S. and Israel want to keep the status quo and have fought against every other means to change it. 42,000 and increasing dead Palestinians is fine with both countries.

Hezbollah, Hamas and the Houthis are fighting against a world power, the U.S. and its proxy Israel. Of course when a small group fights against a world power, they are called terrorists. Meanwhile the U.S. has killed over 25 million people since WW2. Explain to me how Israel's burning babies alive with American weapons doesn't make both the U.S. and Israel terrorists.

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>You're repeatedly attacking the only people defending Palestinians against Israel's above tyranny. Why?

I'm simply pointing out that they are themselves, tyrannical. They aren't in favour of any form of lasting peace themselves. They just lack Israel firepower, so are unable to actually do what they want.

Hezbollah themselves are an Iranian Islamosupremacist proxy. Under no circumstances would I support them ever.

Hamas are even worse. Whilst those groups are the main groups who position themselves as Israel's great enemies, all of Israel's PR is done for them. Hamas is no different ideologically to ISIS.

>Hezbollah, Hamas and the Houthis are fighting against a world power, the U.S. and its proxy Israel.

And they're all Islamosupremacist imperialists themselves. Houthis proudly boast about their use of child soldiers as they fire off missiles against commercial ships in the Yemen strait.

>Of course when a small group fights against a world power, they are called terrorists.

No, the activity of the organisation make them terrorists.

Keelai, tell me, you're pretty pro-LGBT. What do you think of the attitude of Hezbollah, Hamas and the Houthis to LGBT rights? Any comment on that?

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Everything you wrote is a hasbara talking point. Have you read one book on the region? If so, which? I've read close to 20 in the past year and would be happy to exchange, discuss or recommend.

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Fuck off.

Explain to me Hamas position on LGBT rights please. Not answering anything until you stop being such a cowardly piece of shit and answer it.

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You don't read. You're ignorant and prone to stereotypes.

Read a book and then we can continue.

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I refuse to answer any further questions on this until you explain to me Hamas position on LGBT rights. This is non-negotiable.

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BTW, aren't you anti-LGBTQ and support the book bans against LGBTQ and trans storytime for children? If so, that makes you a hypocrite!!

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No. When did I support anything like that?

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Anyway. I'd like to educate you about Hamas. This is their 2017 general principles and objectives excerpts:

"The Islamic Resistance Movement “Hamas” is a Palestinian Islamic national liberation and resistance movement."

"The Palestinian people are one people, made up of all Palestinians, inside and outside of Palestine, irrespective of their religion, culture or political affiliation."

"Islam is a religion of peace and tolerance. It provides an umbrella for the followers of other creeds and religions who can practice their beliefs in security and safety. Hamas also believes that Palestine has always been and will always be a model of coexistence, tolerance and civilizational innovation."

"Hamas believes that the message of Islam upholds the values of truth, justice, freedom and dignity and prohibits all forms of injustice and incriminates oppressors irrespective of their religion, race, gender or nationality. Islam is against all forms of religious, ethnic or sectarian extremism and bigotry. It is the religion that inculcates in its followers the value of standing up to aggression and of supporting the oppressed; it motivates them to give generously and make sacrifices in defence of their dignity, their land, their peoples and their holy places."

"The Palestinian cause in its essence is a cause of an occupied land and a displaced people. The right of the Palestinian refugees and the displaced to return to their homes from which they were banished or were banned from returning to – whether in the lands occupied in 1948 or in 1967 (that is the whole of Palestine), is a natural right, both individual and collective."

"The Zionist project is a racist, aggressive, colonial and expansionist project based on seizing the properties of others; it is hostile to the Palestinian people and to their aspiration for freedom, liberation, return and self-determination."

"Hamas affirms that its conflict is with the Zionist project not with the Jews because of their religion. Hamas does not wage a struggle against the Jews because they are Jewish but wages a struggle against the Zionists who occupy Palestine. Yet, it is the Zionists who constantly identify Judaism and the Jews with their own colonial project and illegal entity."

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"Hamas rejects the persecution of any human being or the undermining of his or her rights on nationalist, religious or sectarian grounds. Hamas is of the view that the Jewish problem, anti-Semitism and the persecution of the Jews are phenomena fundamentally linked to European history and not to the history of the Arabs and the Muslims or to their heritage. The Zionist movement, which was able with the help of Western powers to occupy Palestine, is the most dangerous form of settlement occupation which has already disappeared from much of the world and must disappear from Palestine."

"Hamas believes in, and adheres to, managing its Palestinian relations on the basis of pluralism, democracy, national partnership, acceptance of the other and the adoption of dialogue."

"Hamas stresses the necessity of building Palestinian national institutions on sound democratic principles, foremost among them are free and fair elections. Such process should be on the basis of national partnership and in accordance with a clear programme and a clear strategy that adhere to the rights, including the right of resistance, and which fulfil the aspirations of the Palestinian people."

"The role of Palestinian women is fundamental in the process of building the present and the future, just as it has always been in the process of making Palestinian history. It is a pivotal role in the project of resistance, liberation and building the political system."

"In its relations with world nations and peoples, Hamas believes in the values of cooperation, justice, freedom and respect of the will of the people."

"Hamas welcomes the stances of states, organisations and institutions that support the rights of the Palestinian people. It salutes the free peoples of the world who support the Palestinian cause. At the same time, it denounces the support granted by any party to the Zionist entity or the attempts to cover up its crimes and aggression against the Palestinians and calls for the prosecution of Zionist war criminals."

"Hamas also condemns all forms of colonialism, occupation, discrimination, oppression and aggression in the world."

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You're a fucking moron if you take Hamas at their word there. The Gaza Strip hasn't had an election for nearly 20 years.

https://unwatch.org/rights-group-exposes-palestinian-torture-ahead-of-first-un-review/

This is like reading the North Korean constitution and thinking that they're a genuinely pluralistic democratic society.

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"explain to me Hamas position on LGBT rights."

Done!! Your denial of their support for democracy, liberation, equality including women rights and denouncement of oppression anywhere shows you're a very small person.

Hamas is trying to get basic human rights for all Palestinians first since none ave any and there is an ongoing genocide.

You need to admit when you're wrong. Nothing in their charter is anti-LGBTQ

Now hypocrite, will you condemn the GOP for their ongoing attacks against LGBTQ in the U.S.?

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>You need to admit when you're wrong. Nothing in their charter is anti-LGBTQ

Their charter also speaks as if they're some democratic state, yet they've slaughtered all political opposition and haven't had elections for nearly 20 years. Democratic states don't take hostages.

https://unwatch.org/rights-group-exposes-palestinian-torture-ahead-of-first-un-review/

https://www.christianpost.com/news/witnesses-slain-palestinian-was-tortured-for-spreading-christianity.html

https://web.archive.org/web/20210910161843/https://www.hudson.org/content/researchattachments/attachment/1179/20100108_ct9forposting.pdf

>Now hypocrite, will you condemn the GOP for their ongoing attacks against LGBTQ in the U.S.?

I've condemned the Republicans for that shit many times.

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Btw you ignorant piece of shit, the last time there were free elections and the Gazans voted overwhelmingly for Hamas which is not a puppet and supports true liberation, both the U.S. and Israel defunded them and paid the PA to overthrow and assassinate their leaders. Hamas prevented the coup, defended themselves and kicked the PA out of Gaza.

Go F your phony BS "free elections". The U.S. only allows puppets, you dumb moron!!!!

You're too stupid for words. Wallow in your ignorance rather than educate yourself.

Repeated to get through your thick skull!

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I've just answered this in the other chain.

When was the last election in the Gaza Strip?

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The U.S. and Israel don't allow Gazans to have free elections, dummy. I already answered this, reread above comment.

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How can the USA and Israel stop Gaza from organising elections?

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Btw you ignorant piece of shit, the last time there were free elections and the Gazans voted overwhelmingly for Hamas which is not a puppet and supports true liberation, both the U.S. and Israel defunded them and paid the PA to overthrow and assassinate their leaders. Hamas prevented the coup, defended themselves and kicked the PA out of Gaza.

Go F your phony BS "free elections". The U.S. only allows puppets, you dumb moron!!!!

You're too stupid for words. Wallow in your ignorance rather than educate yourself.

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>Btw you ignorant piece of shit, the last time there were free elections and the Gazans voted overwhelmingly for Hamas which is not a puppet and supports true liberation

And when was the last Gaza election?

>both the U.S. and Israel defunded them and paid the PA to overthrow and assassinate their leaders. Hamas prevented the coup, defended themselves and kicked the PA out of Gaza.

And what happened to the rest of the political opposition in Gaza?

And does that mean you regard Fatah as puppets?

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The U.S. and Israel don't allow Gazans to have free elections, dummy. I already answered this, reread above comment.

Of course, Fatah is a puppet. OMG, you can't so stupid!!! West Bankers hate Fatah because they are corrupt and do Israeli oppressors bidding.

Read!!!! I implore you to lose your ignorance.!!!

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>The U.S. and Israel don't allow Gazans to have free elections, dummy. I already answered this, reread above comment.

And how can they stop them?

Still waiting for your explanation as to what happened to the rest of the political opposition in Gaza. And any explanation you have for Gazas torrid human rights issues.

>Read!!!! I implore you to lose your ignorance.!!!

Have you yourself ever read anything critical of Hamas or Hezbollah before in your life?

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Defunding and killing its leaders like they already have done and doing. Collective punishment of Gazans for voting in their own best interest by denying them the ability to work, dropping bombs on them, denying them food, water, further curtailing travel, denying access to sea for fishermen, denying access to education overseas, etc..

You're repeating the same questions which is becoming boring. Just reread my comments.

"Have you yourself ever read anything critical of Hamas or Hezbollah before in your life?"

ALL mainstream Western media and politicians are critical of both, therefore of course, I have! But, unlike you, I like truth, therefore I seek out various points of view to fully understand a subject.

You like to use triggering terms which aims to shut down critical thinking.

The U.N. has already stated that armed struggle against oppression is acceptable. U.S. fought a Revolution. Palestinians have every right to fight against genocide and ethnic cleansing.

And you have failed to present a winning alternative strategy.

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>Defunding and killing its leaders like they already have done and doing. Collective punishment of Gazans for voting in their own best interest by denying them the ability to work, dropping bombs on them, denying them food, water, further curtailing travel, denying access to sea for fishermen, denying access to education overseas, etc..

What leaders of note were killed in between 2006 and 2023 purely just because they're part of Hamas?

>ALL mainstream Western media and politicians are critical of both, therefore of course, I have! But, unlike you, I like truth, therefore I seek out various points of view to fully understand a subject.

So what is it, other than you apparently just agreeing with their preamble that makes you somehow think they're pro-LGBT and pro-democracy? What about their civil society on the ground somehow leads you to that conclusion?

>The U.N. has already stated that armed struggle against oppression is acceptable. U.S. fought a Revolution. Palestinians have every right to fight against genocide and ethnic cleansing.

Does the UN say that the deliberate targeting of civilians comes under that umbrella?

Are all citizens of Israel fair game? Should they be killed?

Any thoughts on this: https://unwatch.org/rights-group-exposes-palestinian-torture-ahead-of-first-un-review/

>And you have failed to present a winning alternative strategy.

No, I have not. And you haven't told me what winning looks like, according to you.

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Reread since questions answered.

Israel and U.S. routinely kills Gazan and Palestinian leaders. Are you stupid not to know this?

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>Reread since questions answered.

No, you've never given your position on armed 'resistance' against civilians. You keep ignoring that little detail.

>Israel and U.S. routinely kills Gazan and Palestinian leaders. Are you stupid not to know this?

They certainly do since October 7th raised the temperature, sure. Pretty sure if the IRA, acting as the military wing of the Irish government sent death squads into Newry and slaughtered 500+ protestants the UK government would start up invasion preparations of Ireland.

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Only Israel makes war against defenseless civilians.

Btw, Israel killed many of their own citizens on Oct. 7th!!! how and why you ask!

Israel had to release 1,000+ Paestinains years ago to free 1 Israeli soldier so they created a plan in which they will purposely kill Israelis rather than have them taken hostage. They did this on Oct 7th by bombing a building with many Israelis killing them and children with a jet flying overhead.

I bookmarked the operation name somewhere and will give it to you if I find it.

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>Only Israel makes war against defenseless civilians.

This is just not true. Hamas directly targeted civilians on October 7th.

>Btw, Israel killed many of their own citizens on Oct. 7th!!! how and why you ask!

Assuming they did, did they do so deliberately and does that excuse Hamas for doing it?

>Israel had to release 1,000+ Paestinains years ago to free 1 Israeli soldier so they created a plan in which they will purposely kill Israelis rather than have them taken hostage. They did this on Oct 7th by bombing a building with many Israelis killing them and children with a jet flying overhead.

[citation needed]

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No, they targeted military and police which are fair game.

IDF soldier was Gilad Shalit. Google is your friend.

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>No, they targeted military and police which are fair game.

https://www.hrw.org/news/2024/07/17/october-7-crimes-against-humanity-war-crimes-hamas-led-groups

Who were the Hamas paragliders targeting when they went to the music concert?

>IDF soldier was Gilad Shalit. Google is your friend.

No. Give me your direct credible source that Israel deliberately killed its own citizens on October 7th.

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"No, I have not. And you haven't told me what winning looks like, according to you."

This is your only new question so I'll answer it.

Palestinian armed struggle is the only one that successfully works since Israel has stopped all others. Intifada 1 and 2 and Oct. 7 gets world attention and protests and condemnation of Israel's atrocities.

Also Oct. 7 has stopped Saudi Arabia's treaty with Israel. It renewed the movement for liberation with thousands protesting. Leaders have begun to listen to angry constituents and marchers. Several countries have recognized Palestine. Others have stopped weapons. 2-state being talked about again. More are aware of Israel atrocities and social movement for liberation has been made stronger. Israelis leaving in large numbers. Israel economy in tank which will cause more to leave.

Eventually, the U.S. will insist on 2-state solution and abandon Israel's status quo. Or risk losing more Democratic support like Genocide Joe did. Renewed economic boycotts. Eventually those laws preventing BDS will be challenged as unconstitutional. Recently Ta-Nehisi Coates has compared Israel to the Jim Crow South in his book.

The U.S. is the only reason Apartheid Israel still exists. That will end quicker because of Oct. 7.

Three winning strategies: armed struggle. social movements. BDS. All three allow for strong global support and condemnation of Israel.

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>Palestinian armed struggle is the only one that successfully works since Israel has stopped all others. Intifada 1 and 2 and Oct. 7 gets world attention and protests and condemnation of Israel's atrocities.

Gaza is a smoking pile of rubble right now, and Hezbollah is operationally decapitated. How is this working?

Getting world attention doesn't matter at this point. The USA is not going to back Hamas or Hezbollah.

>Also Oct. 7 has stopped Saudi Arabia's treaty with Israel. It renewed the movement for liberation with thousands protesting. Leaders have begun to listen to angry constituents and marchers. Several countries have recognized Palestine. Others have stopped weapons. 2-state being talked about again. More are aware of Israel atrocities and social movement for liberation has been made stronger. Israelis leaving in large numbers. Israel economy in tank which will cause more to leave.

Did Saudi Arabia's abandonment of the treaty with Israel remove the government? Did these protests achieve anything? Did the recognition of Palestine by several countries manage anything? What countries have stopped weapon sales? Has the Israeli government gone anywhere closer to two-state right now since October the 7th? Does the world somehow watching Israel bomb Gaza achieve anything?

>Eventually, the U.S. will insist on 2-state solution and abandon Israel's status quo.

Based on what?

>Or risk losing more Democratic support like Genocide Joe did. Renewed economic boycotts.

Democrats stand to lose way more support by going anti-Israel than they do pro-Gaza.

>The U.S. is the only reason Apartheid Israel still exists. That will end quicker because of Oct. 7.

I can't at all work out how you conclude that.

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Read. Educate yourself. I stand by my comment since you're commenting nonstop about Palestinians for which you're doing because of Oct. 7th.

Israel = pariah
End to their apartheid system is a few short years away.

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So you're too stupid to provide an answer to any of my queries and points there.

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Reread my comments.

RIF.org can help you comprehend.

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So you're unable to back up any of your claims, and arguments about Hamas current effectiveness.

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You're asking stupid questions because you don't educate yourself.

You're too lazy to read books, newspaper and listen to lectures or interviews like I do.

Israel is less safe today. Liberation movement continues. The world hates pariah state Israel for their genocide. Even the Saudi king said he has to listen to his people who are angry, even though he doesn't care about Palestinians.

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>Israel is less safe today.

As compared to when? Before 2023? Probably. Partially because Israel has gone on the offensive and decimated the operational capacity of both Hamas and Hezbollah. Did either of those groups achieve any meaningful goals? Is a two-state solution or secular reimagining of Israel somehow closer, or has Israel dug its heels in? What seems more likely to you?

>The world hates pariah state Israel for their genocide.

And other than frowny faces and stern letters, what does this mean in practice?

>Even the Saudi king said he has to listen to his people who are angry, even though he doesn't care about Palestinians.

And do what exactly?

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You don't know anything about Israel. Read!

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As usual, no reply to my points. Israel has decimated the leadership of Hamas and Hezbollah. October 7th was nowhere near a victory.

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And new leaders emerge. Today a drone attacked Netanyahu's home. So safe...not!

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>And new leaders emerge.

The Hezbollah leader had been there for 32 years. The notion this doesn't damage them is absurd. This is very Monty python-esque from you.

"Alright, we'll call it a draw!"

>Today a drone attacked Netanyahu's home.

Shall we compare this to the immense damage inflicted on the Strip and Lebanon?

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Israel is committing genocide. Finally, you acknowledge that. This will lead to Israel's end as an apartheid state since U.S. will be forced to stop supporting them.

Israel is nothing without U.S. support.

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Sorry, where did my post "admit" that?

>This will lead to Israel's end as an apartheid state since U.S. will be forced to stop supporting them.

Not sure how anything I say, or think, will lead the USA to be forced to stop supporting anything. Who will stop the USA? How?

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US is always the last country to support a shitty government like Apartheid South Africa or oppressive Tolbert's Liberia. U.S. is eventually forced to end support because of anger and condemnation from American citizens and world.

When U.S. support ends, the shitty regime collapses. Israel is next.

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https://www.pewresearch.org/2024/03/21/majority-in-u-s-say-israel-has-valid-reasons-for-fighting-fewer-say-the-same-about-hamas/

Genuine hopium from you on this. And what is it even you think would come next if the USA specifically did change on this?

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Irrelevant since all movements are unpopular when they start like the anti-Vietnam war one. They gain momentum and popularity which creates change. We ended the war because it eventually lost American support. Ditto support for South Africa and Afghanistan.

I'm old enough to witness the change. You need to open history books and read!!! Anti-Israel momentum and condemnation have grown worldwide since genocide began. Apartheid Israel's days are numbered. 2-state on the way.

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>Irrelevant since all movements are unpopular when they start like the anti-Vietnam war one. They gain momentum and popularity which creates change. We ended the war because it eventually lost American support. Ditto support for South Africa and Afghanistan.

The Hamas/Hezbollah shit has been going on for decades now. The US public are still opposed heavily.

You think people now think the Taliban are good guys, by the way? Do you think they are?

>I'm old enough to witness the change. You need to open history books and read!!! Anti-Israel momentum and condemnation have grown worldwide since genocide began. Apartheid Israel's days are numbered. 2-state on the way.

This is genuine copium. It's absurd. Israel has nukes. The word is tut-tutting but nothing is meaningfully changing. The US is glad that Israel is weakening Iranian proxies in the region, and I bet Saudi Arabia and other parts of the Gulf are secretly happy too.

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Iran's pals are Russia and China. They have nukes, too! Iran gave Russia missiles in its war against Ukraine. Russia just delivered weapons to Iran.

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>Iran's pals are Russia and China. They have nukes, too!

What, and you think they'll all nuke Israel, do you?

You overestimate the genuine care any of those countries have to Palestine.

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Both Russia and China have strategic interests in the region. The U.S. isn't going to fight an Iranian war for Israel. Peepsqueak Israel can only fight unarmed kiddies and women. Israel got their asses kicked in the last Lebanon war fighting armed men. Israel would lose a war against Iran, Lebanon or Turkey.

BTW, Israel is mainly bombing unarmed kiddies and women in Lebanon. That's their MO. Such cowards!

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The U.S. and Israel don't want free elections. They want a puppet Gazan government to make legitimate their criminality.

Hamas and Hezbollah have different wings. There is a military wing which carries out armed resistance, but there is also a social services wing which has nothing to do with the military. They feed kids, do medical aide, help the disabled. etc..

But the U.S. and Israel is attacking and destroying them too.

The real reason is to make the oppressed as weak as possible to be 100% reliant on their oppressor. If they want food, they must bow to their oppressor.

Israel has and are destroying thousands of Palestinian businesses, farms, etc.. They literally uproot their olive trees and other plants and make certain that their food is rotted when exported by delaying passage to markets for days. Palestinian poverty was created by Israel, Britain and the U.S..

Have you ever read anything positive about Hamas or Hezbollah before in your life?

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>The U.S. and Israel don't want free elections. They want a puppet Gazan government to make legitimate their criminality.

They don't control the Gaza Strip.

>Hamas and Hezbollah have different wings. There is a military wing which carries out armed resistance, but there is also a social services wing which has nothing to do with the military. They feed kids, do medical aide, help the disabled. etc..

There were also Nazi political wings too. What's your point?

>Have you ever read anything positive about Hamas or Hezbollah before in your life?

Yes, I'm reading it right now apparently. That they do good charitable work doesn't somehow mean they aren't totalitarian islamosupremacist organisations.

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Israel completely controls Gaza. Stupid to think otherwise.

You think all Palestinians are terrorists and Israel can do no wrong. You support genocide.

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>Israel completely controls Gaza. Stupid to think otherwise.

How does Israel control the Gaza Strip?

>You think all Palestinians are terrorists and Israel can do no wrong. You support genocide.

When did I say all Palestinians are terrorists? I said Hamas are terrorists.

When did I say Israel does no wrong?

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How does Israel control the Gaza Strip?

That's a very dumb question. Gaza is Israel's open air prison.
https://www.hrw.org/news/2022/06/14/gaza-israels-open-air-prison-15

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That's controlling their borders (except the southern border anyway since the south of the strip borders Egypt), not their civil society. It doesn't dictate their domestic policy, their education, health, civic, human rights law.

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Israel controls jobs, economy, water supply, all construction, energy, communication, medical aid, export and import of all goods, borders, immigration, emigration, all border crossings, family life in regard to family reunification laws, access to education, tax funds, donations, fishing rights, land access within Gaza, life and death since Israel repeatedly drops 1,000 pound bombs for fun, etc..

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>Israel controls jobs

How, specifically?

> all construction, energy, communication, medical aid, export and import of all goods, borders, immigration, emigration, all border crossings

Some of this is true because of them controlling the northern border. Some of it seems highly debateable. Doubt Israel signed off on Hamas producing an extensive tunnelling system, weapon placements across the strip, nor all the weapon supplies they were receiving from Iran.

>life and death since Israel repeatedly drops 1,000 pound bombs for fun, etc..

Most notably since the elected body of Gaza sent death squads across the border to slaughter Israeli citizens. As I said, if the IRA, acting as the military wing of the Irish government sent militants across the border into Newry to slaughter hundreds of protestants - how do you think the UK would have responded?

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I already answered this question.

Reread all my comments.

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At no point did you answer my Ireland/IRA analogy.

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Ireland is pro-Palestinian rights because they understand oppression.

Btw, Hezbollah formed due to Israel's war on Lebanon. Israel strengthened and funded Hamas. Israel created them.

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>Ireland is pro-Palestinian rights because they understand oppression.

That's not what I asked you.

>Btw, Hezbollah formed due to Israel's war on Lebanon. Israel strengthened and funded Hamas.

Okay. Not sure what that specifically has to do with Israel seriously fucking them up now.

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Mainstream news media doesn't report how Israel is being fucked.

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Share your sources then.

When you say shit like this, you sound like tvfan.

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Books. You hate books!!!

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This is a forum. If you are unwilling to back your claims up, no-one will take you seriously.

And not really sure how books on the history of the conflict and Israel specifically will somehow elucidate me on how Israel, specifically, post-2023 is fucked.

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Stupid people don't take me seriously, anyway. Educated and intelligent on this board already know the situation in Israel/Palestine because they read. You don't.

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What don't I know about it specifically? That Israel has been horrible in the past and is heavily responsible for shaping 2023? Sure. They are. But that doesn't excuse Hamas, nor Hezbollah actions over the years either - nor does it mean that Israel aren't utterly devastating their military power right now.

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You mean U.S. military. Israel is weak without a world power supporting them.

You failed to name a viable strategy for Palestinian liberation besides armed struggle. Put up or shut up!

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>You mean U.S. military. Israel is weak without a world power supporting them.

Israeli military is pretty powerful in its own right, and Israel has its own pretty strong defence industry.

>You failed to name a viable strategy for Palestinian liberation besides armed struggle.

No, I didn't. I noted the viability of the democratic process within Israel, which has been set back by years now due to Hamas. And you still haven't told me what you think Palestinian liberation looks like.

>Put up or shut up!

It's not my responsibility to justify Palestinian terror tactics.

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Israel is not a democracy. It's a racist apartheid ethno-state with open-air prisons committing genocide and stealing land.

U.S. just gave Israel an extra $17 billion plus the usual annual $4 billion in military aide. Plus U.S. delivered military weapons and soldiers. Israel is nothing without the U.S..

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>Israel is not a democracy. It's a racist apartheid ethno-state with open-air prisons committing genocide and stealing land.

Israel is very much a (flawed) multiparty democracy. There are Arab/Secular two-state parties who are, or have been represented in the Knesset and Arab-Israeli citizens can vote for them.

That is the path, or could've been the beginning of the path but Hamas shat all over that in 2023 and hardened all Israelis sat on the fence.

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Nope! You're 100% wrong! Box is too narrow to continue. I'll start a new subject thread to continue Israel discussion.Nope! You're wrong.

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You are a terrorist sympathising hateful piece of shit.

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You are a state-sponsored terrorist sympathising hateful racist piece of shit who supports genocide and ethnic-cleansing.

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You still haven't told me what you think Palestinian liberation looks like. You are notably quiet on what you think should, or will happen.

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Israel has Fatah "controlling" West Bank Palestinians for them. They're basically overseers. They arrest Palestinians attempting a peace march. Meanwhile, if a Jewish settler kills a Palestinian, then Fatah can do nothing because no jurisdiction over Jews in West Bank. Palestinian family has to seek justice with Israel military therefore no justice.

IDF also allowed to arrest and imprison Palestinian without evidence or charges. Fatah has no power to stop this.

Also Fatah power is limited or nonexistent in different W. Bank regions since W.B. is divided into three areas called A, B and C. All Israeli goals, laws and rules are meant to benefit only themselves. IDF has significant policing power throughout WB and controls all borders. They can prevent Palestinians access to hospitals, jobs, school relatives, etc. just for sadistic cruelty. Many die because they're denied passage to hospital or medical treatment including babies. Fatah can do nothing.

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>Both Russia and China have strategic interests in the region. The U.S. isn't going to fight an Iranian war for Israel.

Iran is showing little sign they have any interest a war with Israel.

>Peepsqueak Israel can only fight unarmed kiddies and women. Israel got their asses kicked in the last Lebanon war fighting armed men. Israel would lose a war against Iran, Lebanon or Turkey.

Sorry, what war was this? The 2006 war? Israel has stormed into the Strip and taken out almost the whole leadership of Hamas, and heavily damaged Hezbollah. Who are they fighting now in Lebanon if not Hezbollah soldiers?

>BTW, Israel is mainly bombing unarmed kiddies and women in Lebanon. That's their MO. Such cowards

I'll await evidence that Israel is specifically targeting unarmed kids and women.

>Hezbollah, Hamas and the Houthis are fighting against a world power, the U.S. and its proxy Israel. Of course when a small group fights against a world power, they are called terrorists.

Do you think it's acceptable for the Houthis to target trade ships through the strait? Or to slaughter unarmed civilians as Hamas have done, and gloated about doing, and recorded themselves doing on October the 7th?

They're called terrorists because they use terrorist tactics.

>Meanwhile the U.S. has killed over 25 million people since WW2. Explain to me how Israel's burning babies alive with American weapons doesn't make both the U.S. and Israel terrorists.

Are you just counting anyone who has died in a US-involved conflict, regardless as how, when you claim the US has killed those people?

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>>>it's 100% wrong to say one group is entitled to all land, privileges and human rights based solely on religion.<<<

And you use Cuba as some kind of beacon for human rights in the world? lol!

That's funny, keelai.

The Israel/Pal situation is out of control. But no real surprise, neither side would know human rights even if it slapped them right in the face. Trying to make it sound like Gazans are fighting for human rights is laughable. I do think Israel has made some mistakes in this conflict but "Palestinians" have been making mistakes for 50+ years.

You know, kee, they teach kids to hate Jews. From the time their young to the time they're adults, they're indoctrinated with jew hatred. In Gaza, there is no free speech, women are nothing more than chattel that are made to give birth to 7 or 8 kids, that's why more than 50% of the population is under 18.

Its all by design too so that when the IDF tries to eliminate terrorists they accidently kill kids.

Gays have no rights in gaza either, they're either executed or jailed. Hamas killed their political opponents when they took power in '06. Since then, all they've done is wage war with Israel. And now, the children of gaza are sacrificial lambs for Hamas. Not to mention, the leaders of Hamas don't even live in Gaza, they're billionaires that live in Qatar.

Saying this is about human rights is preposterous. The fact is, they just don't like jews.

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You just repeated every stereotype like an Archie Bunker and you sound just as ignorant as he did.

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😧

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Is this a government video? Public don't have smart phones or Internet!

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ROTFLMAO!!! Yes, they do! I subscribed to a few Cubans with youtube channels when I was refreshing my Spanish.

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https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cyvy3j872q9o

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/latino/drip-drip-harsh-sentences-cuba-protesters-deters-engagement-us-rcna23001

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-57830160


Mmm yes, such a bastion of a beautiful melting pot. Those marching with him are likely just his supporters is all.

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Yet the Cuban president can still walk safely among thousands of Cubans!

Btw, the murder rate in the U.S. is 23x higher than Cuba.

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Dude Cuba lost 3.5% of its population in two years fleeing to the USA

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I already wrote that the U.S. has meddled in Cuba's economy attempting to destroy it since the 1960s. Yes, Cubans are fleeing poverty created by the U.S..

I'd like to see Biden or Trump try to walk among thousands of Americans. And support human rights!!

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>I already wrote that the U.S. has meddled in Cuba's economy attempting to destroy it since the 1960s. Yes, Cubans are fleeing poverty created by the U.S..

You think its purely poverty they're fleeing from? Sure, there's some of that - but it is a one-party dictatorship.

>I'd like to see Biden or Trump try to walk among thousands of Americans. And support human rights!!

I'd like to see Cuba support human rights too by having multiparty elections.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2023_Cuban_parliamentary_election

Man I can feel the pluralism here

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I'd like to see Israel support human rights too by not committing genocide.

Israel is a racist no-party MILITARY DICTATORSHIP.

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>Israel is a racist no-party MILITARY DICTATORSHIP.

This is obviously completely untrue.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_Israeli_legislative_election

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Hilarious. The #1 and #2 liars of MC arguing about shit they know nothing about. lmao

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And what have I lied about? What don't I know about here?

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For Jews-only! as per their “nation-state” law.

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There are 2.1 million Arab-Israelis who can vote.

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They have zero equal rights. They live under Jim Crow conditions. You literally know nothing about Palestine/Israel.

Are you aware that they cannot visit their own relatives in the West Bank or Gaza? Or vice versa. They must pass through checkpoints, also. Family reunification is denied most of the time. Your wife, kids or mother can live elsewhere and you are not allowed to live together or even see other. You can also be deported at any time and your land and house given to a Jewish family.

Explain the “nation-state” law. I bet you know nothing about it because you choose ignorance.

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>Are you aware that they cannot visit their own relatives in the West Bank or Gaza? Or vice versa. They must pass through checkpoints, also. Family reunification is denied most of the time. Your wife, kids or mother can live elsewhere and you are not allowed to live together or even see other. You can also be deported at any time and your land and house given to a Jewish family.

These are bad conditions applied to the people in the West Bank/Gaza. It does not apply to Israeli-Arabi citizens who live in Israel proper. Israel is very much a flawed democracy, but it is not a dictatorship. There are Arab interest parties in the Knesset.

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Israel is not a democracy when half of its people live under a military dictatorship based solely on religion. That's like saying African-Americans had democracy under slavery or Jim Crow.

Palestinians in Israel live under a system of Jim Crow and worst.

Israel strategy is divide and conquer which is the reason Palestinians are separated from each other within West Bank where there is no free travel and sections are isolated and forbidden from travel without Israel permission (rarely given); Gaza isolated, Israeli Palestinians isolated.

"There are Arab interest parties in the Knesset."

No power. Are you aware that if a Palestinian visits a relative in the West Bank or Gaza, they can not run for office? If they're in office, they would be forced to leave?

"Do Arab Israeli politicians play a role as well?
No. I don’t think so. We are too marginal for that."
NO POWER... LIKE I WROTE.

"In 2019, he was elected to Israel’s governing body, the Knesset, as a member of the Balad party, an Arab party that strives to secularize Israel. His party was so vocal about Palestinian rights that the Knesset ultimately voted to ban it from running for reelection, accusing it of “undermining Israel as a Jewish and democratic state.”
I TOLD YOU SO!!!

"You cannot continue ignoring that there are millions of people living under siege. There are millions of people living under occupation. Occupation by definition is a violent, continuous act.... The world should understand that we are not struggling for better slavery conditions. We are struggling for liberation. We are struggling for justice and equality for all."

"I grew up in these areas—Lod, Ramla, and Jaffa are such areas—where you see discrimination and racism toward you in all aspects of life. You see the differences in infrastructure, in the services the state gives to Arabs and Jews."
https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2023/10/former-palestinian-knesset-member-explains-his-party.html

Explain the “nation-state” law. I'm still waiting.

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>Israel is not a democracy when half of its people live under a military dictatorship based solely on religion. That's like saying African-Americans had democracy under slavery or Jim Crow.

It's not half of its people.

>Palestinians in Israel live under a system of Jim Crow and worst.

Again, are you referring to Israeli citizens of Palestinian/Arab descent or Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza?

>No power. Are you aware that if a Palestinian visits a relative in the West Bank or Gaza, they can not run for office? If they're in office, they would be forced to leave?

They don't have power because they don't have enough support from the wider population. They have to win elections, or win enough support to become part of a coalition.

>"In 2019, he was elected to Israel’s governing body, the Knesset, as a member of the Balad party, an Arab party that strives to secularize Israel. His party was so vocal about Palestinian rights that the Knesset ultimately voted to ban it from running for reelection, accusing it of “undermining Israel as a Jewish and democratic state.”

What? The Balad Party was briefly banned in 2009, but it was overturned and it's been active since as part of various cross-party coalitions and pacts.

>Explain the “nation-state” law. I'm still waiting.

Do you mean the law in Israel that officially designates it as a Jewish state?

Care to explain the opposition parties in the Strip, since you're so overtly anti-dictatorship?

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A little more than half are Palestinian.

I suggest you read the link to answer your own question.

LOL. Jews ethnic-cleansed Palestinians so they wouldn't have power.

Balad has zero power. Did you read the link?

The only power is the Israel government, a military dictatorship. Israel subcontracted some security to Palestinians because IDF, especially in Gaza, were getting their a$$e$ kicked. No Palestinian party has any power and most are complicit with Israel's oppression except for Hamas which defiantly calls for liberation.

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>A little more than half are Palestinian.

Of what? The overall population of Israel proper, or including the West Bank and the Strip?

>Balad has zero power. Did you read the link?

Because they don't have enough support. In addition, there's Ra'am (United Arab List), and Hadash-Ta'al and the recently formed The Democrats.

>The only power is the Israel government, a military dictatorship. Israel subcontracted some security to Palestinians because IDF, especially in Gaza, were getting their a$$e$ kicked.

It's bizarre to me how you can gloat about Hamas military prowess at all given the absurd disparity in casualties over the many decades between both of them. Israel utterly outweighs Hamas in tech, personnel and tactics.

>No Palestinian party has any power and most are complicit with Israel's oppression except for Hamas which defiantly calls for liberation.

Hamas doesn't support liberation. Once they won power, they converted Gaza into a one-party islamist dictatorship. They haven't had an election for nearly 20 years in Gaza. Why is this?

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Israelis don't want Palestinians to have any power. You can't be that dense. Israelis deport Palestinians from Israel to keep their population low.

Israel empowered Hamas and gave them millions in funds. Why?

Hamas is only security since they have no power. No Palestinian party has power so elections are irrelevant. They have to get rid of Israel's tyranny to have self-determination and free elections.

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>Israelis don't want Palestinians to have any power. You can't be that dense. Israelis deport Palestinians from Israel to keep their population low.

And Hamas don't want Jews to have any power in their hypothetical state. They are at an impasse.

>Israel empowered Hamas and gave them millions in funds. Why?

To discredit the pro-Palestinian movement by essentially forcing it to be fronted by violent islamosupremacist psychopaths.

>Hamas is only security since they have no power. No Palestinian party has power so elections are irrelevant.

They have power in the strip.

>They have to get rid of Israel's tyranny to have self-determination and free elections.

Why can't they hold another election in the strip to see if Palestinians want Hamas to represent their struggle?

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Did you read a book yet? I don't want to chat with an imbecile.

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You're too stupid to answer any of my points about Hamas blatant islamosupremacism, anti-LGBT and terrorist activities. You fundamentally ignore eveyrthing about what they are.

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You never explained how YOU would end Israel and the U.S. tyranny against the Palestinian people. Still waiting for your answer.

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There is no simple solution. Israel completely outguns and outnumbers Hamas and thus the aggressive, terrorist response just cannot work. Israel regards it as a fight for survival. Israel, unlike the Gaza strip actually does have a, albeit flawed multiparty democracy. Each time Hamas murders Israeli citizens, Likud and Religious Zionist parties gain in the polls. There are actually secular and arabic interest parties that run in Israel, but if their indirect associates are murderers they simply won't ever win anything.

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You didn't answer the question so try again. I'll give 2 liberation strategies and why they don't work for Palestinians.

1. Peaceful mass marches were successful for civil rights, women rights, anti-Vietnam War, Yellow Vest in France, Ghandi.

Palestinians have hundreds of checkpoints, walls, borders so no free movement and are isolated from each other so not possible to gather. Also, illegal so arrests and Gazan marchers including kids killed by IDF snipers. March leaders killed by IDF.

2. Economic boycotts successful in ending South Africa apartheid.

Israel made economic boycotts of Israel products illegal worldwide including in U.S.. BDS (Boycott, Divestment, Sanctions) has an excellent chance for success if employed worldwide which is why Israel lobbied to criminalize it.

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>Palestinians have hundreds of checkpoints, walls, borders so no free movement and are isolated from each other so not possible to gather. Also, illegal so arrests and Gazan marchers including kids killed by IDF snipers. March leaders killed by IDF.

Palestinians, Arabs and other Israeli leftists and secularists are also within Israel proper and can advocate, protest and win elections under the banner of a two-state solution or major egalitarian state reform. This is made incredibly difficult however, if the main symbol of the two-state solution happen to be islamofascists who really have no interest in that at all.

>Israel made economic boycotts of Israel products illegal worldwide including in U.S..

If the rest of the world is so inclined, you can't stop individuals from refusing to buy Israeli items.

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No. Israel equates peaceful Palestinian marches in Israel with terrorism so it's illegal. Palestinian marchers can be arrested, lose their homes, lose Israel citizenship and deported to Gaza or West Bank.

Individual BDS helps a little. Major success would be for companies to join, but they can be sanctioned since made illegal. Ben & Jerry's was threatened a few years ago with their BDS attempt.

Name new strategies.

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>No. Israel equates peaceful Palestinian marches in Israel with terrorism so it's illegal. Palestinian marchers can be arrested, lose their homes, lose Israel citizenship and deported to Gaza or West Bank.

So why haven't secular/leftist palestinian/arab/two-state interest parties all been banned in Israel?

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/dec/03/protest-tel-aviv-against-israel-gaza

https://www.timesofisrael.com/several-small-protests-in-israel-oppose-gaza-war-some-back-islamic-jihad-terrorists/

It happens.

>Name new strategies.

I've given you my answer. Israel has a political system that can, in theory, elect a secular/liberal/leftist coalition that could make moves on this. That's the answer. Genocidal religious fanatics indiscriminately bombing Israel merely causes Israelis to vote for Zionist parties and dipshits like Ben-Gvir.

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Only dozens of marchers? Dozens = nothing. Total failure. Also called FRINGE by media.
Palestinian Parties = No power. You already acknowledged this.

One link is very old from 2022. Liberal and secular Jews are voiceless in Israel now. Israel becoming a fascist theocracy.

Can you name any NEW strategies?

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>Only dozens of marchers? Dozens = nothing. Total failure. Also called FRINGE by media.

But you said they were all banned by default.

>Palestinian Parties = No power. You already acknowledged this.

Yet they still exist. Why haven't they been banned?

>One link is very old from 2022. Liberal and secular Jews are voiceless in Israel now. Israel becoming a fascist theocracy.

What policy has been constructed post October 7th that means Israel is turning into a fascist theocracy?

>Can you bame any NEW strategies?

No. Win elections. The left/secularists in Israel have formed into "Democrats" which seems likely, currently to get 10 seats and possibly be a part of any new government. Ra'am and Hadash also will pick up 10 seats between them.

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Jews can march. I said Palestinians can't.

Dozens = nothing.
Only dozens of Jews marching for peace and called fringe = fascist environment in Israel.

Genocide = Fascism.

Ameluk speech and support = fascism and mass support for genocide .

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>Jews can march. I said Palestinians can't.

There are Israel citizens of arab descent who absolutely can march and do march in Israel.

>Only dozens of Jews marching for peace and called fringe = fascist environment in Israel.

How do you know they were all Jews?

What specific policy passed since October 2023 means that Israel is now a fascist theocracy specifically?

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They were all Jews. I already told you that no Palestinian has freedom to travel including within Israel. An Israeli Palestinian is denied free movement within Israel and closely monitored thru their phones with mandatory government tracking devices. They must also carry specific IDs and passes.

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>They were all Jews.

No. How do you know this?

>I already told you that no Palestinian has freedom to travel including within Israel.

What about Arab-Israeli citizens? This my focus here as they make up 20% of the population of Israel-proper.

> An Israeli Palestinian is denied free movement within Israel and closely monitored thru their phones with mandatory government tracking devices.

Can I see the data for this please? Does this apply to Arab citizens of Israel?

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Yes, I already wrote Palestinian Israelis. Only Jews allowed at marches. Reread my comments where you'll find the answer.

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Where is your evidence that only Jews are allowed at marches there?

Making claims is not providing an answer.

Back your shit up.

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When you find a Palestinian at a Jewish march, let me know.

Similarly, Israel was able to also stop Hasidic Jews from leaving their neighborhoods during covid using the same monitoring technology that they routinely use against Palestinian Israelis. Hasidic Jews didn't want to get the covid vaccine so the government prevented them from leaving.

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>When you find a Palestinian at a Jewish march, let me know.

You said only Jews. 20% of Israel citizens are of Arab descent.

>Similarly, Israel was able to also stop Hasidic Jews from leaving their neighborhoods during covid using the same monitoring technology that they routinely use against Palestinian Israelis. Hasidic Jews didn't want to get the covid vaccine so the government prevented them from leaving.

Are all Arab Israelis subject to this technology?

Can I see some evidence for this Hasidic claim pelase?

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Fascism has won in Israel. Even Jews tweeting for compassion towards Palestinian children have been arrested and lost their jobs. Liberals are beginning to leave Israel which is becoming an intolerant theocracy.

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>Fascism has won in Israel. Even Jews tweeting for compassion towards Palestinian children have been arrested and lost their jobs.

Without denying it, can I see the context here?

>Liberals are beginning to leave Israel which is becoming an intolerant theocracy.

And I daresay the support for far-right groups and religious zionist groups in Israel has a lot to do with the actions of Hamas and Hezbollah that drive Israelis to those groups out of fear.

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"support for far-right groups and religious zionist groups"

You already agree with me. But, you're blaming the victim. Palestinians suffering for 75+ years have a right to end their oppression.

You have failed to name a winning strategy that Israel hasn't already made illegal and/or powerless.

I'll name another since you suck at this. Peace negotiations like Oslo. Those have completely failed because they legitimized and increased Israeli oppression which ultimately lead to 2 Intifadas.

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>You already agree with me. But, you're blaming the victim. Palestinians suffering for 75+ years have a right to end their oppression.

No, I'm saying that Hamas/Hezbollahs activities push people in Israel to those groups. Hamas and Hezbollah cannot outgun Israel and thus making it an existential battle for Israel hardens the resolve of the Israeli population.

Palestinians, or indeed anyone, do not have the right to randomly slaughter people.

>I'll name another since you suck at this. Peace negotiations like Oslo. Those have completely failed because they legitimized and increased Israeli oppression which ultimately lead to 2 Intifadas.

What to you constitutes "legitimising" Israeli oppression specifically?

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You're obviously an apologist for Israeli oppression and genocide.

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And you're obviously an apologist for Hamas murdering LGBT people.

See how I can play this stupid game too?

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You never gave an alternate winning strategy for Palestinian liberation, thereby showing that armed struggle is the only way.

MLK Jr and Ghandi were hated and called names, also. Oppressers will continue to oppressed unless forced to stop. A Civil War was needed to stop U.S slavery.

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>You never gave an alternate winning strategy for Palestinian liberation, thereby showing that armed struggle is the only way.

First of all, what does "Palestinian Liberation" even look like according to you? What's the outcome?

And yes, I did. The Israeli system is not so degraded that it cannot reform from within. I reject your premise.

>MLK Jr and Ghandi were hated and called names, also.

Not sure when MLK Jr. organised a bunch of militants to maraud through white neighbourhoods, massacring hundreds of people and taking hostages.

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Yet MLK Jr was thrown in jail and hated anyway.

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Okay so? He still didn't do what Hamas or Hezbollah do.

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Still hated and attacked.

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Right, I don't get the relevance here. Are you saying because MLK was attacked and history judged him right, that any and all resistance movements are also judged the same way just because they're might also have bad press now?

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No. I'm saying oppressors always attack the oppressed including their leaders.

History didn't judge him right. He won and a number of years after he died (no longer a threat), it became acceptable for the news media and public to stop criticizing him and instead praise him.

I'm old enough to have witnessed the societal change re: MLK Jr..

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>No. I'm saying oppressors always attack the oppressed including their leaders.

Okay. So what?

>History didn't judge him right. He won and a number of years after he died (no longer a threat), it became acceptable for the news media and public to stop criticizing him and instead praise him.

So history judged him right.

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You and other genocide supporters will regret it in the future similarly the way Germans became ashamed after Hitler's fall.

You're not on the side of history.

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I haven't supported a genocide.

Israel can be wrong, and so can Hamas and so can Hezbollah. This isn't hard.

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You support everyone trying to stop genocide therefore you do support it.

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Do you mean I "don't" support everyone trying to stop genocide?

Hamas and Hezbollah are both Islamosupremacist movements. I will never support either of them in any capacity.

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No that's not an explanation. It's a Jewish-Supremacist state law similar to Jim Crow's white supremacy. Only Jews have any rights. No one else. Discrimination is legal against non-Jews. Jewish groups have condemned the law:

"Backlash abroad has shown disapproval of the law by Jewish groups, with the American Jewish Committee stating the law "put at risk the commitment of Israel's founders to build a country that is both Jewish and democratic". Additionally, Jonathan Greenblatt, CEO of the Anti-Defamation League (ADL), said: "While there are provisions that we agree with—notably with regard to state symbols like the anthem, flag, and capital Jerusalem; as well as in re-affirming that the State of Israel is open to Jewish immigration—we are troubled by the fact that the law, which celebrates the fundamental Jewish nature of the state, raises significant questions about the government's long-term commitment to its pluralistic identity and democratic nature."

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>No that's not an explanation. It's a Jewish-Supremacist state law similar to Jim Crow's white supremacy. Only Jews have any rights. No one else. Discrimination is legal against non-Jews. Jewish groups have condemned the law:

Israeli citizens of Palestinian heritage are able to vote in Knesset elections, and they do. Most of them presumably in the last election voted for Hadash, Ra'am, Meretz, Balad and Labour, comprising about 17% of the vote.

Israel should become a secular democratic state, if that's what you are asking.

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Israel isn't a secular democratic state. Furthermore, it wants to be and is a Jewish-supremacist state.

Voting without any power is irrelevant. Citizens in the USSR used to vote, also. The main political power now in Israel is an extremist-far right fascist Jewish-supremacist groups responsible for the ongoing genocide and war. Do you read any Israeli newspapers? I read several.

You support religious persecution and discrimination including against Christians? Are you ok with Palestinian Christians being forced to leave Bethlehem and Jerusalem because they're not Jewish?

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>Israel isn't a secular democratic state. Furthermore, it wants to be and is a Jewish-supremacist state.

I didn't say it was secular.

>Voting without any power is irrelevant. Citizens in the USSR used to vote, also. The main political power now in Israel is an extremist-far right fascist Jewish-supremacist groups responsible for the ongoing genocide and war.Do you read any Israeli newspapers? I read several.

What "power" should Arab-Israeli citizens have they have that they don't have here? If the parties they vote for don't get enough support, they don't get enough support and they can't govern. That's the same in every electoral system. It's not remotely comparable to USSR show elections.

>You support religious persecution and discrimination including against Christians? Are you ok with Palestinian Christians being forced to leave Bethlehem and Jerusalem because they're not Jewish?

No, I'm not. Are you okay with LGBT people being killed in the Gaza strip?

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Did you pick a book to read yet? Which one?

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As usual, no answer.

I'm going to take a leaf from your book. You support Hamas. You hate LGBT people. You want them to be murdered. Your are a homophobic piece of shit.

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Read a book. It does a mind good.

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Homophobic apologist says what?

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I have neighbours who went to cuba years ago.. they said there were brothers selling their underage sisters in doorways...

i suppose it's no shock that these "people" stand with palestine/islam.

two cheeks of the same ass.

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ROTFLMAO! Your delusions are old stale stereotypes.

Unlike you, I know real people who went to Cuba.

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sure you do doll. you left wing extremists have a problem with reality.

men can be women, cuba is a paradise, islam is peace...

leftism is a mental disorder.

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Video speaks for itself. Cuban president safely walking among thousands.
Your denialism = mental disorder

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cuban dictator walks among his people with bodyguards, while his people know the whole time if they even look at him wrong they'll be hung.

do you also believe that those north koreans crying and on their knees like james brown were really sad? and not scared?

ahahaha, you make a great case for why women didnt and shouldnt have the right to vote.

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israeli dictator does the same, only difference is if people look at him sideways, they will be raped then hung

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